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Message started by Brian on Nov 19th, 2015 at 3:12pm

Title: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 19th, 2015 at 3:12pm
@ Christer

Are you interested in using Win10?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 20th, 2015 at 3:54am
@ Brian

Well, yes and no. My current system was built in early 2011, dual booting WXP and W7. I don't think that I will take advantage of the free upgrade to W10. To me it seems to be a "hit or miss" operation. The next build will be running the, at the time, current OS.

Maybe I'll change my mind about upgrading ... :-/ ... I've never even seen a computer running W10.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 20th, 2015 at 4:30am
@ Christer

Win10 will be around for many years and it would be a shame not to at least have your computer "Activated" for Win10 while it is free. Even if you don't use it. You could remove your HD0 and install an empty HD. Then clean install Win10 using your Win7 serial. Win10 will automatically activate. You would then remove the HD and reinstall your WinXP/Win7 HD. Microsoft will then regard your computer as OK for any Win10 installs in future years.

I'm a Win10 fan. I upgraded Win8 to Win10, a 20 minute procedure. Unlike previous OS upgrades, 8 to 10 works without issues. I've done several dozen upgrades.

https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/6815/microsoft-will-now-let-windows-10-upgraders-use-windows-7-8-or-8-1-product-key-to-activate

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 20th, 2015 at 5:21am
@ Brian

I never did it before but I tried to split the last few posts from the original thread. It didn't turn out as I hoped. I expected to be able to choose a thread title but it doesn't seem like it and the posts appear in the reverse order.

Anyway, the tail is wagging the dog. I'll read up on "thurrott" which probably generates a few questions.

Edited: I was able to manually modify each post with a new thread title and reversing the order of the posts was done by clicking the thread title. You never stop learning ... 8-) ... !

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 20th, 2015 at 2:02pm
@ Christer

I've found the easiest way to upgrade Win7/8 to Win10 is to download an ISO from...

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/techbench

... then write the ISO to an 8GB (or larger) USB flash drive with Rufus.

https://rufus.akeo.ie/

I had issues running the ISO from the HD. No issues using a UFD. Others burnt the ISO to a DVD and ran setup.exe from the DVD.

In Windows, run setup.exe on the flash drive. Answer a few questions. Easy. I always declined the Download and install updates question. The updates will download after the install anyway. You don't have to have your Win7/8 updated to the latest update from Windows Update before starting this method.

Last week Win10 build 1511 was released (available from the above link). It is the first Win10 build that allows you to do a clean install using your Win7 key. Previously you had to upgrade Win7/8 and activate (automatic) Win10. Once Win10 was activated you could format the HD and clean install Win10 if you desired. Or just keep the upgrade. I kept the upgrade as it was "perfect". All my apps and settings were still present and there were no glitches at all.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 22nd, 2015 at 6:04am
@ Brian

In September, I went almost "all the way" and let Microsoft install the "get windows 10" updates. I downloaded the "MediaCreationToolx64" which created a bootable USB-drive as well as an ISO to burn to DVD. Either of them would run off-line to do the upgrade to Windows 10.

Next, I used Ghost to restore the system "back to normal".

I was under the impression that -

- I had to upgrade the current system to W10, which would be automatically activated. A new key would be generated which I would be able to extract for future reinstallations from "square one".

- After that, my Windows 7 key would be "dead" unless I within 30 days revert back to Windows 7 by uninstalling Windows 10.

I thought that Microsoft tries to "kill" all operating systems prior to Windows 10. Do I understand it correctly that, doing it "your way", I can run both operating systems, by swapping different HDD's, activated using the same original Windows 7 key? I would, however, need to download different media to install Windows 10 on a new HDD.

I've also had thoughts about the "fully updated Windows 7 prior to ugrading to Windows 10" requirement. Wouldn't it be better with as little Windows 7 crap (updates) as possible, to get an as lean as possible Windows 10?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 22nd, 2015 at 11:04am
@ Christer


Christer wrote on Nov 22nd, 2015 at 6:04am:
I was under the impression that -

- I had to upgrade the current system to W10, which would be automatically activated. A new key would be generated which I would be able to extract for future reinstallations from "square one".


There is no new key to extract from Win10. Your Win10 sends a hardware hash to a  Microsoft server so your computer will be identified when or if Win10 is reinstalled in the future and the new Win10 will be activated. For example, you could upgrade Win7 to Win10, rollback Win10 to Win7 within the one month period, upgrade Win7 to Win10 in a few years time and Win10 would be activated. Or you could upgrade Win7 to Win10, rollback Win10 to Win7 within the one month period, experience a HD failure in a few years time, install Win10 to a new HD and Win10 would be activated.

You can also do this, which you may have done. Image your current system. Upgrade Win7 to Win10. Win10 is activated and Microsoft recognizes your computer. Restore your image and have no Win10. Your computer will be OK for a clean Win10 install in the future. No Win7 key will be needed.

I'm multi-booting with BIBM so I can have multiple independent OS in primary partitions. No booting files are shared. I cloned my Win8 partition to the same drive, upgraded one Win8 to Win10 and now I have two activated OS. Win8 and Win10.

Microsoft have (? temporarily) withdrawn the 1511 update ISO so at present you can't clean install using a Win7 key but there is a workaround....

http://www.ghacks.net/2015/08/30/how-to-clean-install-windows-10-directly-without-upgrade/

http://www.wilderssecurity.com/threads/how-to-do-a-clean-windows-10-install-without-upgrading-first.379551/

The link I posted above....

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/techbench

... now gives you a pre 1511 ISO, but that's OK.


Christer wrote on Nov 22nd, 2015 at 6:04am:
I've also had thoughts about the "fully updated Windows 7 prior to ugrading to Windows 10" requirement. Wouldn't it be better with as little Windows 7 crap (updates) as possible, to get an as lean as possible Windows 10?

I don't think it matters because after the upgrade your previous OS files are in a folder called "Windows.old". This folder can be deleted using Disk Cleanup, after which you can't rollback. I always delete this folder as I know I won't be rolling back. I have an image if I want to restore the previous OS.




Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 22nd, 2015 at 1:02pm
@ Brian

It seems like I have some homework to do. Regarding the hardware and licensing, I run an OEM version which is not transferable to another system and as I understand it, there are limitations to hardware changes to the current system. I recently changed the graphics card and installing W10 on a new SSD would also constitute a hardware change but I guess that this would be within limits and not affect activation.

... ::) ... I had made up my mind to not upgrade to W10 ... :-? ... but doing it on a new SSD, only to go back to W7 on a HDD really would put me on the hill with that other fool!

I'll sit on my hands and see what happens on the "Win10 build" front. There's no real hurry.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 1:47pm
@ Brian


Brian wrote on Nov 22nd, 2015 at 11:04am:
Microsoft have (? temporarily) withdrawn the 1511 update ISO so at present you can't clean install using a Win7 key but there is a workaround....

Microsoft yanks latest Windows 10 release from its download server


Quote:
Downloading the tool from the same page today results in a file with an earlier version number: 10.0.10240.16480.

That's the version I downloaded in late September.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 2:11pm
@ Christer

My version is 10.0.10586 Build 10586

I downloaded the ISO on 13th November from...

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/techbench

The file-name is Win10_1511_English_x64.iso. That site is now offering Win10_English_x64.iso which is the previous Win10 version.


Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 2:52pm
@ Brian

From Microsoft yanks latest Windows 10 release from its download server


Quote:
Update: The version 10586 Media Creation Tool is still available from an unpublished link on Microsoft's download servers. Microsoft will probably remove it before long, but for now at least it works to upgrade systems running the original (build 10240) release of Windows 10 or to create a version 1511 ISO file.

I downloaded the tool from that link but it was not a x64 version but that's the tool itself. When I ran it, it said to analyse the system and offered the 64-bit version. I'm not sure but I believe that I have the latest, withdrawn, version.

When media creation was complete, it noted that when upgrading from W7 or W8, no key is needed but when doing a clean installation, a W10-key is needed. You said that, with this version, a W7 or W8 key would do. So, the question is, what have I got?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 3:00pm
@ Christer


Christer wrote on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 2:52pm:
but when doing a clean installation, a W10-key is needed.


Just click "Skip". I recall a key is requested twice but you don't have to enter a Win10 one at all.

I haven't tried a clean install using a Win7 key.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 3:26pm
@ Brian


Christer wrote on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 2:52pm:
So, the question is, what have I got?

I checked the properties of the USB-drive created in September:
964 files in 100 folders > 3 429 496 593 byte
The version of setup.exe is 10.0.10240.16384

I checked the properties of the USB-drive created today:
969 files in 98 folders > 3 147 995 914 byte
The version of setup.exe is 10.0.10586.0

(The number of files and folders and the total size will vary depending on version of Windows 10 and language.)

It seems like I should consider myself lucky to be directed to that webpage over at Windows BBS.

Edited: You posted while I was typing - I've read your comment on "skipping the key".

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 3:34pm
@ Christer

I'll try a version 1511 clean install in the next half hour. Just making the UFD now.

Edit ... My 1511 64-bit Win10 Pro UFD has 3.81 GB of used space. Are you using Win10 Home?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 3:47pm
@ Brian

I'm using Windows 7 Professional, Swedish language version and I assume that it will be upgraded to the corresponding Windows 10 version.

I've not seen mention of version 1511 anywhere on the installation media. What is the version of setup.exe on your USB-drive?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 4:05pm
@ Christer

I forgot my ISO was a combined Home/Pro version and that's why it is large.

The 1511 install from booting the UFD to the Win10 desktop took 9 minutes. Fast. I clicked "I don't have a Product Key". I also clicked "Skip this step" when asked for a Microsoft account. Skipping lets you use a Local account.

My setup.exe is 10.0.10586.0

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 4:27pm
@ Brian

Thanks for all your efforts to assist! Having the same setup.exe probably means that we also have the same (1511) version.

I'm hesitant to ask more silly questions but when does the system finally ask for the Product Key? When first connecting to the internet and MS servers?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 4:32pm
@ Christer


Christer wrote on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 4:27pm:
when does the system finally ask for the Product Key? When first connecting to the internet and MS servers? 


There are no product keys for Win10 as far as I know. I just checked my recent 1511 install. It is Activated because I've previously activated a Win10 on this computer. A Win8 to Win10 upgrade. The activation for Win7/8 to Win10 just happens. You don't have to do anything.

This is a multi-boot computer. I have 5 Win10 installed. All are activated.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 4:48pm
@ Christer

Have you done a Win7 to Win10 upgrade and then restored your Win7 image? If so your computer should be fine for clean Win10 installs.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 5:01pm
@ Brian


Brian wrote on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 4:48pm:
Have you done a Win7 to Win10 upgrade and then restored your Win7 image?

No, I never went all the way. I created the media and then bailed out.


Brian wrote on Nov 20th, 2015 at 2:02pm:
Last week Win10 build 1511 was released (available from the above link). It is the first Win10 build that allows you to do a clean install using your Win7 key.

This quote is from reply #4 and I interpreted it as being able to install W10 on a new HDD or SSD on a system that had not previously been upgraded.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 5:33pm
@ Christer


Christer wrote on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 5:01pm:
I interpreted it as being able to install W10 on a new HDD or SSD on a system that had not previously been upgraded. 


That's correct. I haven't been able to try this because all my computers have already been "Win10 activated".

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 24th, 2015 at 12:04am
@ Christer


Christer wrote on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 5:01pm:
No, I never went all the way. I created the media and then bailed out.


I'm a keen upgrade man. You have everything to gain and nothing to lose by upgrading to Win10 and then restoring your Win7 image if you don't like Win10.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 24th, 2015 at 4:06am
@ Brian

One final ... ;D ... question:

My HDD is split in three partitions - partition 1 (primary) with WinXP, partition 2 (primary) with Win7 and partition 3 (logical on extended) with data. All partitions were created and formated during setup of WinXP to make Ghost 2003 work (partition alignment). There's no "200 MB system partition" but all that has ended up on partition 1, I guess.

Now, upgrading Win7 to Win10, would that bring changes to partition 1, necessitating creation of a new Image of that partition, in parallel with an Image of partition 2 with Win10?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 24th, 2015 at 4:20am
@ Christer

Your WinXP and Win7 booting files are in the WinXP partition. If you upgrade to Win10, the Win10 booting files would be installed into the WinXP partition too. If you wanted to revert to Win7 I'd expect you would have to restore both the WinXP and Win7 images.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 24th, 2015 at 1:13pm
@ Brian

Okey, that's what I thought. Even after April 2014 (no more updates to WinXP) have I created parallel Images, just to be sure.

From reply #14:

Christer wrote on Nov 23rd, 2015 at 3:47pm:
I've not seen mention of version 1511 anywhere on the installation media. What is the version of setup.exe on your USB-drive?

I have gone google on this and as I understand it, "1511" is a version number indicating the release year and month as opposed to "10586" which is the build number.

I searched for "Windows 10 build 1511" (which is a common mixup) and several hits provided information/speculation/hypothesis about the reason for Microsoft to withdraw it.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 24th, 2015 at 5:34pm
@ Brian


Brian wrote on Nov 22nd, 2015 at 11:04am:
Microsoft have (? temporarily) withdrawn the 1511 update ISO so at present you can't clean install using a Win7 key but there is a workaround....

It seems like the tail is wagging the dog. 10586 is back!

My post at Windows BBS

Now, your link in reply #4 and #9 also downloads the "1511" version.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 24th, 2015 at 6:41pm
@ Christer

Weird. On, Off, On.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 25th, 2015 at 2:29am
@ Brian

The question is if there was a problem (hush-hush) that has been corrected on the servers, meaning that running the tool today will give a different ISO or UFD compared to last week?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 25th, 2015 at 2:47am
Microsoft reverses course, restores downloads of Windows 10 November Update

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Nov 25th, 2015 at 3:42am
@ Christer


Christer wrote on Nov 25th, 2015 at 2:29am:
meaning that running the tool today will give a different ISO or UFD compared to last week?      

I checked the MD5 and SHA-1 of today's download. It's the same ISO as last week.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Nov 25th, 2015 at 4:04am
@ Brian

Okey, thanks for that test!

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Dec 1st, 2015 at 1:59am
Since upgrading to version 1511 there have been four Windows Updates. Three cumulative and one Flash. Fairly small judging by the decrease in partition free space.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Dec 1st, 2015 at 9:38am
@ Brian

Are updates to Win10 released on the second tuesday of each month or are they let loose "as needed"?

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Brian on Dec 1st, 2015 at 12:49pm
@ Christer

As needed I think. The dates were Nov 15, 19, 25.

Title: Re: Upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 10 or not
Post by Christer on Jul 28th, 2016 at 1:48pm
I haven't reread this thread from top to bottom but a few months ago, I upgraded my desktop from Win7 to Win10. I created images of the partitions (dual boot of WinXP and Win7/10) both before and after the deed and restored the "before" images, reverting to WinXP and Win7. Since then I have used the regedit


Quote:
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsUpdate]
"DisableOSUpgrade"=dword:00000001

to avoid the nagging.

It worked until July 26 when the folders "$WINDOWS.~BT" and "$Windows.~WS" appeared on my system.

I pray that in two days ... ::) ... these "friendly intrusions" ... :-X ... will be history!

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