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Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possible? (Read 5553 times)
cardinal23
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Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possible?
Dec 10th, 2005 at 3:35pm
 
Hello,
My sincere thanks to technical contributions to this forum. 

I'm wondering if the following will work:.
I have ordered Ghost 9.0.  It comes with Ghost 2003.

1.  I want to Ghost a Windows 98 drive.  Note: It is NOT second-edition.
2.  I am virtually certain it has USB 1.0 or 1.1.  It is almost certainly NOT USB 2.0.
3.  I want to buy an External Hard Drive.  I would like to buy an 80GB drive (or bigger).  Is it relevant that Windows-98 doesn't recognize drives larger than 32GB?  I want to confirm that this is irrelevant as I intend to only Ghost a drive image onto this external drive and never boot it.

So, in an effort to avoid a mistake, I submit the following summary:
- Buy any 80 GB USB external hard drive
- Install Ghost 2003 on this old PC running Windows-98 first edition
- Ghost the Windows-98 C: drive onto the external drive.

My concerns are that
- Windows 98 doesn't present any problems which I don't think it will because I boot into Ghost (if you know what I mean).
- I don't have any problems with a new USB 2.0 external drive and the old USB ports on this old Windows 98 machine.

In other words: Do you think it'll work?  Am I missing anything?  Any "watch it"s on the horizon for me?

Thanks so much,
Cardinal23.
 
 
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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #1 - Dec 10th, 2005 at 4:36pm
 
It would ceratinly work if you got another internal drive. External USB drieves work on a case by case basis, depending on the controlller, the chipset, and the drive.

El Pescador is the expert when it comes to getting Ghost to work with external USB drives. Check out his recommendations for drive, controller, chip set, etc.

Because Ghost 2003 runs from DOS, it shouldn't matter that your operation system is W98.
 
 
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cardinal23
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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #2 - Dec 10th, 2005 at 4:41pm
 
Thank you Spanky.
You wrote:

Because Ghost 2003 runs from DOS, it shouldn't matter that your operation system is W98.

Just to make sure I understand: Are you saying that this Ghost process running from DOS won't care that the attached USB drive is bigger than 32GB?  Is that what you're saying?
 
 
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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #3 - Dec 10th, 2005 at 4:49pm
 
Sorry.  I need to follow up.
Can I buy an 80 GB drive and put it in the old W98 machine as a slave and and Ghost to it (C: to E:)?  Assuming this is allowed (despite being >32GB) Will I have to do anything to the 80 GB before Ghosting (formatting, partitioning, etc.) or will Ghost accept a raw out-of-the-box drive.  (I'm concerned that if I have to format it or anything W98 won't let me)
 
 
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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #4 - Dec 10th, 2005 at 6:36pm
 
cardinal23

If your Win98 OS will not recognize a HDD >32 GB, then when booted to Win98, it will not recognize the 80 GB's.

In DOS--it will not matter what Win98 can or can not do--but, if your motherboard's BIOS will only recognize HDD's less than 32 GB--then in DOS, only up to the 32 GB's can be used.  Basically, Ghost in DOS will *see* whatever size HDD that your BIOS supports.

When you boot to DOS and want to use a USB external HDD, you are using the DOS USB HDD driver that is loaded during boot--and not any Windows based USB drivers--so it will depend on the DOS USB driver whether it handles your particular USB controller correctly.  The DOS USB HDD driver by Iomega included with Ghost 2003 has less compatibility with various USB controllers than the Panasonic USB HDD drivers:

A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
 

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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #5 - Dec 10th, 2005 at 6:42pm
 
Thank you.
I intend to
1.  Buy an enclosure, put a less-than-32GB drive in it and see if it will work.
2.  If it fails, I'll try the Panasonic driver.
< simple this PC is old and frail, I am reluctant to open the box, and install the new drive as a slave. >

Q: Is there a particular enclose that "tends to work" in such environments.  I understand that it might not work, but perhaps someone has had good luck with a particular enclosure.  (I assume it is the enclosure that matters and not the drive in it.)
 
 
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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #6 - Dec 10th, 2005 at 7:07pm
 
cardinal23

Sorry--I have no personal experience with *enclosure kits*--I only have a *Iomega USB 2.0 HDD*--maybe someone else can contribute--do a search on El_Pescador--he has mentioned several enclosures and how well they have performed.

Many HDD's have jumper settings to force them to appear to be a 32 GB HDD--usually older HDD's in the 40-120 GB range--check documentation.
 

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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #7 - Dec 10th, 2005 at 7:13pm
 
Great.  Thanks. 
Do you know the answer to this:
If I buy a HD that can be made, via jumpers, to appear to be less that 32GB, can I write to it (in this dimished mode) and later remove the jumpers when I use it on a XP box?

In other words:
- Put the jumper on.  Use it on a Win9x box.
- Write data to it.
- Remove the jumper
- Write more data to it on an XP box.
Thanks,
David
 
 
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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #8 - Dec 11th, 2005 at 1:55am
 
cardinal23

I'm not absolutely positive--but, I'm guessing *no*--when you change the jumper, the drive *geometry* is completely changed--would have to re-partition and re-format would be my best guess.

But, you could first hook it up and transfer the image to another HDD for storage until you have changed the jumpers and re-partitioned and re-formatted.
 

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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #9 - Dec 11th, 2005 at 1:57pm
 
cardinal23 wrote on Dec 10th, 2005 at 6:42pm:
"... Is there a particular enclosure that "tends to work" in such environments.  I understand that it might not work, but perhaps someone has had good luck with a particular enclosure.  (I assume it is the enclosure that matters and not the drive in it.)..."

I have five external enclosure kits with USB 2.0 capability, and the Macally PHR-100AC (CLICK HERE) may very well be my absolute favorite external enclosure kit for a number of reasons: (1) mine has an on/off switch unlike my PHR-100A and PHR-100ACB; (2) the USB 2.0/FireWire 400 (IEEE 1394a) combo bridge chipset is
much more flexible (to the extent I would recommend it even when FireWire connectivity is not applicable)
than that of the PHR-100A when dealing with both NEC-compliant PCI-to-USB host adapter cards and with the aggravating Intel onboard USB host controllers intergrated with many motherboards today (which expedites use with both Norton Ghost 2003 and Partition Magic 8.0); (3) it can be readily shared between two computers (FireWire to one and USB 2.0 to the other) where the USB 2.0 will take priority so when you plug in the USB cable the FireWire connection will be disabled - unplug the USB and control will then revert to to the FireWire connection; and (4) the mounting system for securing the HDD to the chassis is vastly superior to the "two-screws-on-a-flat-plate" found on my Kingwin SS-350S-BK and my PPA 2179 780SAU2.

Up to now, my only reservation has been the passive cooling, i.e., I have been reluctant to mount any HDD in it that has more than two platters - particularly if the enclosure is kept constantly powered up whenever the host PC is active.  However, recent developments indicate that overheating with the larger HDDs is due to the inadequacy of the stock power supply transformers - and Macally is issuing beefed-up units to customers suffering from higher operating temperatures.  At any rate, the most tractable IDE HDD for mounting in external enclosure kits I have found is the 120GB Seagate Barracuda (while the 80GB IDE Barracuda is much less so - go figure !!!) and with HDDs in the 80-to-120GB range, overheating is a non-issue.

Contrary to posts on this forum berating USB 2.0 in favor of FireWire based on published artificial benchmarks, my own testing with Norton Ghost 2003 "disk-to-image" Backup procedures demonstrate that USB 2.0 is consistently - though not markedly - faster than either Firewire 400 (IEEE 1394a) or Firewire 800 (IEEE 1394b).  The deficiency of the latter is due to a lack of drivers being developed for DOS-based operations, and in my testing has shown no advantage over FireWire 400 - with a single rare and anomalous event.  

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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #10 - Dec 11th, 2005 at 2:19pm
 
May I ask a question?
My friend has an old Windows 98 first edition PC.  I do not wish to open the case.  I wish to Ghost its 4 GB C: drive.  It does have a USB port (probably USB 1.0).  I am concerned that it will not recognize any enclosure / hard-disk combinations.  Can you suggest which enclosure / disk you would try first.  If I were to open the case, could I install a USB PCI card?  Do they make such things?  Is the Panasonic driver a good bet?

In summary, I need to close the C: drive of a very old Windows 98 (first edition) PC that I'm afraid to handle much.  Ghosting to an external drive would be ideal.
 
 
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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #11 - Dec 11th, 2005 at 2:36pm
 
cardinal23

Quote:
It does have a USB port (probably USB 1.0).  I am concerned that it will not recognize any enclosure / hard-disk combinations.

There's no 100 % way to answer that except by trying--there are *dedicated* USB external HDD's that seem to have fewer *compatibility* issues--once the image is on the USB HDD, the image can be transferred to any other storage media elsewhere if that is more convenient.

Quote:
If I were to open the case, could I install a USB PCI card?

Is the motherboard a PCI based motherboard?--or is so old that it uses ISA add-on slots?

Quote:
Do they make such things?

There are lots of PCI USB add-on cards--primarily to upgrade systems that came with USB 1.x built into the motherboard before USB 2.0 became available.

Quote:
Is the Panasonic driver a good bet?

Based on posts to this forum--it has the widest compatibility with different USB controllers and enclosure kit USB chipsets.

 

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Re: Ghost 2003 - Windows 98 first edition - Possib
Reply #12 - Dec 11th, 2005 at 2:47pm
 
cardinal23 wrote on Dec 11th, 2005 at 2:19pm:
"... If I were to open the case, could I install a USB PCI card?  Do they make such things?..."

http://radified.com/cgi-bin/YaBB/YaBB.cgi?board=general;action=display;num=11333...

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