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new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy (Read 6981 times)
360freq
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new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Jul 26th, 2006 at 7:27am
 
  hey gang,
i'm a new member who emailed Rad about my (1st time) PC partition plan involving 4 HD's.  he gave me the encouraging nod to go ahead, but i changed the strategy in a few ways.  all the components i have are brand new.. so i'm starting fresh.

before i begin wth Partition Mag 8 and a desk full of drivers, i would appreciate suggestions or comments from the fine folks (y'all) on Rad's forums.  my intent is to understand the process, gain exp by doing it myself, and have an efficient system as a result.  http://radified.com/YaBBImages/cool.gif
Cool    

the most intense s/w i will work with is Adobe CS.. so i want to make sure the fast access partitions are on the outer edge.

this is the strategy:

*  36gb SCSI  = 2 partitions (dual boot)  >  18gb for Win 2K ... 18gb for XP

*  73gb SCSI  = 3 partitions (the drive i will "work on")  >  
30gb = P-Shop swap/page files ... 30gb = graphic editing ... 13gb Program Files

* 250gb SATA  = 4 partitions (storage)  >  85gb = graphic files ... 85gb = data files ... 60gb = mp3's ... 20gb = "Ghost" backup images

* 250gb SATA - for backup (empty, set in RAID 1 mirror)

-------------------------------------------------------
System:
Athlon 64 3700 (2.4ghz)
MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum mobo  
OCZ Platinum PC3200 2gb RAM  
XFX GeForce 6600GT 128mb - PCIe Video
-------------------------------------------------------

i'll setup the SATA drives (in RAID 1) after i reboot., so the o/s and SCSI are without strange anomalies.

also i've read many articles and FAQ's, but have yet to find any that lay out the sequential order of setting up a new system.  
is this oK ?:

1. F6 -- install SCSI controller and motherboard drivers
2. ( PM 8 ) Partition the hard drives
3. install Win2k > service packs ... then XP > service packs
4. Reboot
5. install video card drivers
6. run Defrag before installing programs

TIA for your input    -- Brian / 360freq / bzhawk @ yahoo
 
 
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MrMagoo
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #1 - Jul 26th, 2006 at 5:50pm
 
How you set up your partitions depends highly on how you want your computer organized and how you will use it.  I don't see anything wrong with your setup, but only you can say what exactly will work best.

I don't know if it is really necessary to defragment a a new install.  Usually deframentation isn't necessary until the system has some time to delete files you stop using within the file system to create fragmentation.  Maybe I'm missing soemthing.

Also, I'm not sure where you are installing the motherboard and scsi drivers to if the OS isn't installed yet.  Usually, this is part of the process of installing the OS.
 
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #2 - Jul 26th, 2006 at 6:04pm
 
yeah, you have the idea. you want the faster drive to run your operating system & apps, and the slower drives should be used for mass storage. i like yer set up. let us know how it goes.
 
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360freq
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #3 - Jul 28th, 2006 at 11:00pm
 
MrMagoo --

<<"I don't know if it is really necessary to defragment a new install">>

** believe your correct, i was referring to a "clean install".

<<"I'm not sure where you are installing the motherboard and scsi drivers to if the OS isn't installed yet.  Usually, this is part of the process of installing the OS">>

** thanks for clarifying that.  this is the text i found regarding the step sequence:

<<"The BIOS must boot from the  CD-Rom drive. To begin, access the BIOS/CMOS settings and look for the Boot Sequence.  Make sure it's set to "CD-Rom" before the "C" drive.  After installing the OS from the boot SCSI CD:  boot the CD .. the screen goes blue .. at the bottom on the grey strip it says  "press F6 to install SCSI drivers" .. do that and now install the mobo SATA drivers from the floppy.. then continue on">>
 
 
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MrMagoo
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #4 - Jul 29th, 2006 at 3:32am
 
Correct.  That blue screen that it is talking about is the very first part of the Windows installation process.  You will want your drives partitioned before you begin that.
 
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Tnelson
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #5 - Jul 29th, 2006 at 4:24pm
 
Yup.


This looks like a good setup.  What SCSI controller?   Generally i unplug all drives except what i am installing on.  Do the OS install, so it shows up as C:\ (installed and it showed up as F once)

More than likely, you are going to have to:
POST
Bios Setup
SCSI RAID controller setup
Boot to windows 2000 CD to install (f6 at the beginning for SCSI drivers)
Partition
Install first OS, drivers, updates
Reboot to XP disk, f6 again,
Install on the 2nd partition on the OS drive, load drivers, and updates
Then install and begin your partitioning of the other drives (will have to use onboard raid/scsi raid controller config to do this)


Just as a note, why W2k and XP.  I can understand 98 and XP for legacy apps, or some form of  Linux/BSD and XP for functionality or swaping files, or Server 03 and XP (rare, but still understand able, 1 machine practicing DNS/DHCP/AD setup).  But 2000 and XP are the two closest relatives in the Windows OSes.  XP is built on 2k and just has increased functionality.....Ever considered a vmware solution, use that to boot 2k inside xp in the rare times you want it?
 

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360freq
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #6 - Aug 2nd, 2006 at 10:54am
 
Tnelson -- i appreciate you lending your logical ear.  i've been busy fighting LA city hall so it's been taking time away from this.

the controller i'll use is the Adaptec 29320A-R SCSI-3 RAID.. and i will only hookup one HD at a time.

please confirm this, the beginning steps i'm still unsure of:
do i first boot to windows and then partition .. or.. if partitioning is the first step in the process, then the PM8 Cd works on its own and is not installed as a software ? 

though it does makes sense that after the 1st HD is partitioned, then i will have a "place" to install the O/S and svc packs.

--------------------------------------------------
<<"Just as a note, why W2k and XP ?">>

that's a good question.  i may have software that is not XP compatable, like older versions of graphic apps.. and i have some resources for new XP s/w versions.  my mobo has the recent nVIDIA chipset which will not even run win98, so it's just a safe measure having 2000 and XP to choose from.

now, what you mentioned regarding the "vmware" solution.. i'll assume that has something to do with the term "virtual". i've never worked with XP so that must be a new feature (?).
anyway, i'm sure it's over my head .. and my computing neighbor never suggested vmware as an option (i say this cause he knows XP reasonably well).  if it's something that is worthy to investigate, i surely will.. but i get the impression it's not simple.

i am though, concerned about setting up the RAID.. and here at the RadForum i may have Q's upon getting to that stage.

embarrased to say i am quite new to the BIOS and setting up a new PC.  but i did install the mobo, cpu (w/thermal grease) and hooked up all the cables, jumpers etc..  i think i'm good to go -- just need to understand the sequence of events.
 
 
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #7 - Aug 10th, 2006 at 9:53pm
 
The partitioning will be both part of the process and inside windows.  You will have to partition the original windows partition in the setup.  But you can partition all the others from inside windows.


This is what i recommend.  Start with the ONLY the 36.7 gig drive in there, and 1 cd drive, and a floppy drive.  

Turn it on and let it post (see all the hardware).  Then press 'del' to enter the bios.  Make sure to set up any options you want at this time.

Boot to a windows CD (would start with xp), as it boots, when it first goes to the blue screen, you have an option to load drivers ( it will say press f6)  YOU MUST HIT f6 at this time.

You should have your scsi card boot drivers loaded onto a floppy drive.  It will then ask you to load the drivers for the scsi card, and you will load them.  Then you will go to partitioning of the 36 gig and do it how you want it. (looks like you want 2 partitions on this drive)

Then let it finish the windows setup.  At this time, load all drivers and service packs for XP.  

Then shut down, and install the rest of your hard drives.  You will have to install the 2  250s on your raid controller and use the motherboard setup (right after post)  There will probably be some settings in the bios to enable, then setup in the sata raidcontroller setup.  Boot back up to your xp drive, and then go about partitioning your drives as you see fit ( either use windows or partition magic)

Now you have a full set of drives under 1 OS, and all partitioned out like you want them.

then repeat the install process to put 2k in the other partition of the 36 if you want.  





Here is why i recommended VMWARE.  It is a solution outside of windows, and vmware desktop is free.  This will let you emulate another operating system inside of windows.  It will almost be like a remote desktop, and you could load into windows 2000, inside XP.  

As a note, since both 2k and XP are built on the NT kernel, and are 32 bit etc, there are very very few apps that will run on 2k but not on xp.  Its not simple, but then, neither is a dual boot multi partition system.  

If you dont plan on using 2k very often, the vmware setup is what i recommend.  That way you arent wasting time booting and rebooting, and setting up and maintaining a huge partition setup.  You say you want easy, but then have this large and complicated dual boot scheme.  doesnt jive.
 

Local ghost long time user, working on netcasting.
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360freq
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #8 - Aug 11th, 2006 at 4:25pm
 
that's very useful info .. appreciate.  i'll have some reading to do with  vmware.   

have to look into it, but thought i had apps that were written for 98/NT/2000  --  and since i can't run 98, win2k was the alternative.

back in an easier, more friendly clime.. i d/L'd a bunch of helper apps, and it took me a long time to seek out the ones that work.


 
 
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360freq
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #9 - Aug 11th, 2006 at 5:38pm
 
Tnelson --

just as a sidenote.. i have a reg version of Adobe Acrobat 4.0 in which i can pdf documents.  i've been using it inside W2k, even though on the system requirement 'readme' it says compatable with W98/NT. 

this should not be able to run on W2k, though it does and i doubt it would install on XP.  so there's an example of why i would want to use 2000 and Xp.
 
 
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Re: new SCSI setup, 4 HD Partition strategy
Reply #10 - Aug 12th, 2006 at 6:27pm
 
Thats a terrible example.   4.0 was put out before xp existed, so there is no reason that it would have "xp compatible" on the software.
http://softwareupdates.adobe.com/updates/detail.jsp?cid=648
Adobe 4.0 was released in 99.  XP didnt come out until 01.  There is no way they could have predicted the future and said "xp compatible"  I promise, 4.0 will work in xp.



This is what i have been trying to get across: if it is usable in 2000, its usable in XP. If it works in NT, there is a very good chance it will work in XP.  I have only heard of one or two apps, and they were very specialized, that could only work on 2k, and i guarantee you arent using any of them.  Like i said before, there are a lot of reasons to mulitboot, but 2k to xp is not one of them. XP, 2k and NT are all built on the NT kernel, most programs that work in NT, work in 2k, and in XP.

Now there are things written that work on XP, that dont work on 2k, but thats because of things added to XP that are not part of 2k, but thats a whole different ballgame.



One of the big reasons it is taking so long for Microsoft to get Vista out is because of legacy hardware and apps support.  Microsoft has always tried to support old apps, and old hardware, giving them the largest possible userbase, and allowing people to upgrade without losing that crappy calendar program they are addicted to or an old wheel of fortune game they bought 5 years ago.  
When my grandfather finally upgraded to xp last year, i installed some of his  programs that were "win 95 compatible"  They worked fine.


I'm trying to help you out, and not be a prick.  I work on everything from 500mhz gateways with 2k and xp, to custom built gaming rigs.  I have built 2 with fairly similar hardware to what you have in the last month.  I own 7 pcs personally, one very similar to what you have except no SCSI, but I have WD SATA Raptors in Raid 0.  This type of thing is what I do professionally.  If you want to email me and ask questions, feel free.  tnelson008@yahoo.com


Oh, and there are way more helper apps for XP than there are for 2k.  Look into microsofts "powertoys" along with tweak xp, sysinternals, and winternals.  All good stuff for people wanting to play with the finer points of XP.
 

Local ghost long time user, working on netcasting.
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