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Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11) (Read 19894 times)
shendy
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #15 - Feb 21st, 2008 at 12:58pm
 
The usb drive is a WD Passport 80gb.  Probably 2 or 3 years old now.  It's powered via USB.  I got the USB Y cable so it could draw off of 2 usb ports.  I also bought a dlink 7 usb powered hub to use for this so I wouldn't have to use 2 ports off of the laptop.  That just showed up so it's not connected yet.  The passport has a jack for an external power supply so maybe I should buy the proper power adapter for it or see if I have something lying around with the proper voltage/connector.  Hadn't thought of that.  The Toshiba laptop is 3-4 years old now.  (One reason why I'm being more diligent about backing it up these days!)

Thanks!
 
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #16 - Feb 21st, 2008 at 1:07pm
 
I would concentrate on the NAS and direct connect (with wireless disabled) to start with.

It's best to have the usb2 hard drive directly connected to the laptop.  Most all debugging FAQ's say to direct connect if you are having issues--mainly this removes one more potential element in the possible chain of events.

Look in Device Manager (my computer/properties/hardware) to be sure that all usb ports and usb devices have power saving options disabled.  Also, make sure that your laptop is not going into screen saver or sleep mode during the backup process.
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #17 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 11:12am
 
Just an update.  The darn thing is still going.  48 hours now. Sad  Hopefully it will finish sometime today.  It's at 42.6 gb.  If I did the math right that's about 247kb/s and 14.8mb/min  Not sure if I have all the zeroes in the right place Smiley.  Not good.  Am gonna do some research on the WD web page to see what they say about this NAS drive.  What's interesting is that Ghost's progress/performance window says that it is 0% complete and that there are no operations running (so I can't adjust the performance slider).  Yet there is network traffic and I can see the backup file size change. 

I made the mistake of configuring the backup for high compression thinking that if the file was smaller that it would transfer quicker.  I am thinking that was wrong.  So that's part of the issue. 

Question:  since this is a drive image backup will it try to backup 80gb including empty space or just the 52gb of data.  Am guessing somewhere in between.  At high compression I would've expected it to be done at 42gb if it was just doing 52gb.  If it's doing the whole 80 gb then the ultimate file size is about 60% of that or about 48gb.  Is that right?  If so, there's hope that it will be done this evening when I get home.
 
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #18 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 11:57am
 
shendy wrote on Feb 22nd, 2008 at 11:12am:
I made the mistake of configuring the backup for high compression thinking that if the file was smaller that it would transfer quicker.  I am thinking that was wrong.  So that's part of the issue.  
Question:  since this is a drive image backup will it try to backup 80gb including empty space or just the 52gb of data.  Am guessing somewhere in between.  At high compression I would've expected it to be done at 42gb if it was just doing 52gb.  If it's doing the whole 80 gb then the ultimate file size is about 60% of that or about 48gb.  Is that right?  If so, there's hope that it will be done this evening when I get home.

Ghost creates a backup of only the USED sectors/space in a partition. It also does not backup the page file.  A partition of 52gb of used space should create a backup-image-file of about 26gb at high compression, and maybe 30 gb or so at normal compression.  No way it should take 48 hours. 

I doubt if it is doing anything, especially since Ghost says it is at 0%.
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #19 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 12:03pm
 
Just to compare, today I just backed up (using Ghost 12) a data partition which is 144 gb in total size and 22gb used, from internal sata drive to external usb2 drive and it took about 15 minutes.  The resulting backup image file size is 13gb.
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #20 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 12:18pm
 
<sigh>  Rats!  Guess I'll kill the job later then.  Why is the file still growing though?  Tomorrow I will:

make sure Norton AV is disabled (I did disable the outgoing email worm protection) last night without any difference in transfer rates.. could already have been hung though)
change compression to standard.
maybe uninstall the AV altogether for now
delete vsnap.idx on the e: drive
chkdsk e: /f
chkdsk e: /r
reboot laptop
reboot the NAS drive.
reboot the router
then try again

Any other suggestions?  Thanks.
 
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #21 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 12:28pm
 
Try copying a 500mb or 1gb file using Windows Explorer, from your C: to the nas device and then again a different file from the E: usb2 drive to the nas device.  See what kind of performance and throughput you get.

Get normal throughput working first before moving to testing Ghost.

Search Google and other websites for info on NAS performance and throughput, as well as network throughput.  For example, tcp receive window size plays a big factor in XP relative to network throughput.

I'm not an expert at all on NAS devices, but they should work better (if that is really where the problem is) than you're experiencing.
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #22 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 12:40pm
 
Thanks.  I don't expect it to ever be as fast as what you are getting.  But it WAS way better than this!  Only major change that I can think of is the installation of the Norton suite and the removal of the Kaspersky suite.  The C drive backup completes ok, but even that seems to be much slower than before at a super quick 7-8 hours!!!  It was closer to 2-3 hours before (I think..would have to check the event log to see.  I might do an incremental c: backup tonight with the AV disabled and see what happens by morning).  Data transfer has always been slower going to the NAS drive.  I moved my iTunes library over there for example and updates go slower now.  I'd like to get it going direct to the NAS drive but if not I will try to make some room on some other drives and do the backup to that and then copy over to the NAS OR hook it up direct to the NAS and do an old fashioned copy/paste.  I should probably just do that, but I am stubborn and want to try to do it through ghost.
 
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #23 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 1:01pm
 
Just because I know you care...I found this review.  I don't have the access problem he mentions though. The reviewer complains about its' slowness but I wish I could get mine going this fast.  Speed sounds closer to what I was experiencing not that long ago though.  I'd be happy with that.  I'd run the backups at night so it wouldn't bother me.   Reliability and consistency would be a big plus though!
....

Summary: I purchased this unit in order to run Windows backups to it.

It comes with a 1000BaseT (Gigabit) ethernet port and a USB port. However, the device can ONLY be accessed by a network connection.


The USB port is for adding an ADDITONAL USB hard drive, such as a WD Combo drive, or some such. (Which I have two of and unlike this product, they are great!)


Anyway, I plugged it in and immediately found that the ___mybook__ method of accessing the device did not work without generating errors. (___computer name_ is the universal method for accessing network file servers, which this "NAS" device is.) The errors I was getting were failures to write to the MyBook World Edition II.


After tinkering around with things, I discovered that if you use the IP address (___IP ADDRESS__) and MAP a drive letter to it, the problem goes away.


So I then ran my backups. I have a server on my network and decided to run a comparison test. I backed up my PC to the both the server and the MyBook World Edition II. Here are the results:


78 GigaBytes to the File server using Windows XP Backup:


80 Minutes


78 GigaBytes to the MyBook World Edition II, Win XP Bkup:


270 Minutes (!)

 
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #24 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 1:54pm
 
shendy wrote on Feb 22nd, 2008 at 12:40pm:
I'd like to get it going direct to the NAS drive but if not I will try to make some room on some other drives and do the backup to that and then copy over to the NAS OR hook it up direct to the NAS and do an old fashioned copy/paste.  I should probably just do that, but I am stubborn and want to try to do it through ghost.

I'm not encouraging you to give up on Ghost 12.  Just suggesting that you verify throughput with simple tests to try to isolate the problem.

This proably won't affect anything, but I know there have been two updates to Ghost 12 since it first came out.  Help/Run LiveUpdate from the Ghost 12 toolbar.

If you have option of connecting NAS either as USB2 or ethernet, try USB2.  As I mentioned privously be sure the wireless is disabled.  Control Panel/Network/ then disable wireless or some laptops have special ctrl keys to disable wireless.
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #25 - Feb 22nd, 2008 at 2:25pm
 
I understand.  At some point I might grab the trial ver of Ghost 14.  Looks like it will automatically create a backup on ext drive 1 and then copy backup files to NAS/another drive/offsite.  But you are right, I'll do some more throughput testing first.

Thanks for your patience.
 
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #26 - Feb 25th, 2008 at 12:22pm
 
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=C26EFA36-98E0-4EE9-A7C5...

Came across this nifty utility from Microsoft.  Sync Toy.  Am hoping this will do what I need with that E: drive.  I don't really have to have an image of that one.  I tried Ghost's file & folders option but ran into the same problem as with trying to image it.  The WD Mybook NAS drive is neither NTFS or FAT32.  It's a proprietary format of some sort.  Ugh!  Can't find anything really wrong with network throughput and have had a look at my hijackthis.log too.  That e: drive has a lot of large compressed files on it which is probably contributing to the slow transfer.  The Ghost progress screen really isn't all that informative.  Sync Toy and even the Windows backup program at least tells me what file it's copying and/or gives me a file count.  With sync toy I know exactly what file it's copying and % complete so I know that it's not just hung. I'll still use ghost for imaging the c: drive though.  At least for now.
 
 
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Re: Unable to back up partition using NS&R 1 (or 11)
Reply #27 - Feb 25th, 2008 at 2:23pm
 
Although I use Ghost for image backups of my operating system partition, I don't use it for data-partition backups.  I define Ghost backups as "independent" recovery points because then everything I need to recover is in that backup-image-file.  Others on this forum like the incremental backups, but I just like the simplicity of a full/complete/independent image backup all in one file.

Microsoft's free Synctoy as well as Replicator (www.karenware.com) and Goodsync (www.goodsync.com) and lots of others are good for data backups.  Plus when you see the backup file/folder, you actually SEE the backup file.  So you only need to update the backup with changes copies of your music, video, documents, etc. not the whole partition.

 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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