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- "Sure" switch = integrity check? (Read 6951 times)
George
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- "Sure" switch = integrity check?
Dec 16th, 2009 at 7:56pm
 
I have Norton Ghost 2003 from a boxed Ghost 10.0 and have used Ghost before on 2kpro and 98.
But will Norton have a problem with recognizing or using an appropriate driver under this setup using XP Pro (or 2kPro) ?

It's rather important at this stage because the machine in question is a clean install for my parents and needs a reliable back up for quick restoration before extra problems happen. It is very important to them and I live far away...

I'll only be using a single IDE channel because it only comes with one (I'm considering buying a controller _ )... but I've read comments about Norton using a generic driver, so from '03/'05 or whatever Mr. Norton feels appropriate. I've got a choice of burners but it's a late model hd.


System:

Board:                  M4A79 Dlx

- Chipset:            AMD 790FX / SB750
- CPU/
  Northbridge:      Athlon II
- IDE:                        Single Channel,      Master: (burner of choice)
                                                                       Slave:  UDMA/ATA100 160GB (cable select)
- Floppy


On Board: but only potentially enabled and not to be used for cloning (I hope, ~single IDE  Roll Eyes )

- Firewire:      VIA VT6315N
- of course:      SATA, and e-SATA which could prove very handy

There is a possibility of a controller (Promise FastTrack (TX2?)/Ultra100) / HighPoint HotRod (66 iirc) / new) because of the single IDE but I'm praying all will be fine.
- Multiple partitions formatted under XP install on pristine drive

- Linux:      If anyone can suggest something, let me just say that I am not a fan of LVM; this machine is on F9 but I use others

tia
 

- M4A79 Dlx, AthII  |   WD ide Seagate sata
- (btw, this machine rocks and is whisper quiet with 4 case/1mosfet  fans and 90x25 high pressure on the chip)
- Win7pro, XPpro, 2kpro, Linux
 
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Spanky
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Re: M4A79 Dlx and Ath II, single IDE and floppy, XP Pro Will It Work?
Reply #1 - Dec 16th, 2009 at 9:18pm
 
it would be impossible for anybody to respond conclusively unless they have the actual system you mention, which i doubt anyone does. and even then there's no guaranty.

you could always test it to see for yourself, which is what i'd do, or grab a newer version of ghost, or even try something like clonezilla.

http://mt4.radified.com/2009/05/clonezilla-best-free-hard-drive-backup-solution....

with that said, i see no reason why not.
 
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George
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Re: M4A79 Dlx and Ath II, single IDE and floppy, XP Pro Will It Work?
Reply #2 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 8:12am
 
Thanks Spanky,
I'll give it a go later today/tomorrow.
For now with Ghost as I'm familiar with it.

Will post back with results.
 

- M4A79 Dlx, AthII  |   WD ide Seagate sata
- (btw, this machine rocks and is whisper quiet with 4 case/1mosfet  fans and 90x25 high pressure on the chip)
- Win7pro, XPpro, 2kpro, Linux
 
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NightOwl
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Re: M4A79 Dlx and Ath II, single IDE and floppy, XP Pro Will It Work?
Reply #3 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 10:50am
 
@
George

ASUS M4A79 Deluxe Review

Nice specs!

Quote:
But will Norton have a problem with recognizing or using an appropriate driver under this setup using XP Pro (or 2kPro) ?

It's a little unclear as to how you intend to use Ghost.

With only one HDD, I assume you are either going to put images on a separate partition on that HDD--or plan on burning images to an optical writer. 

If the former, then you only will have half the protection that backup images offer--if that single HDD fails, not only does the actual OS get lost, but so too the backup image(s)!

If the latter, that's a very slow imaging process--if you're not going to image often, then that's probably not a big issue!  And, compatibility between Ghost and optical writers is a common issue--the only way Ghost can write to an optical drive is if Ghost's built-in writing software recognizes the optical drive--a 5-6 year old Ghost 2003 software may not be up to date with 2009 optical drive hardware!

And, make sure you do an *Integrity* check of the image file on the optical disc(s)--the most common problem reported when using optical discs is that the image procedure *seemed* to go well, but the Integrity was never checked, and when it comes time to restore--nothing!  That's really a bad feeling!

Quote:
- Win7, XPpro, 2kpro, Linux

Are you planning on putting all those OSs on the system?  Even if just Linux, then you will probably have a special boot loader--that means the default behavior of Ghost 2003 will only back up the absolute 0 sector of the Master Boot Tract--and the boot loader will be somewhere in sectors 1 thru 62--and will not be included in a backup image unless you use the *-ib* (image boot) switch that tells Ghost to back up the entire boot tract (0-62) so that boot loader is not left out!

If restores will always be to the same HDD, and only partition restores--then the restoring the Master Boot Tract will not be an issue!

Quote:
It's rather important at this stage because the machine in question is a clean install for my parents and needs a reliable back up for quick restoration before extra problems happen. It is very important to them and I live far away...

I've never been a fan of this concept of using Ghost images--*I'm installing Windows *clean* and I want an image of that pristine point in time so I can restore it if something goes wrong......*

Problem is--*Life Happens!*  I last installed WinXP on my system 5 years ago--I would loose everything done since then if I installed a *pristine* image created back then to my system now--there have been so many changes, new programs installed, etc.--it really is not even a little bit of a benefit to want to consider going back!!!  Even installing a restore image that is 6 months or a year old would be a large loss.  I use Ghost to keep recent images--usually every 2-4 weeks between new image creation (unless I'm doing a major install--I always create a new image prior to that just in case something might go wrong!)--and I keep images going back approx. 3-6 months--but I would never want to restore those *older* images unless I had to--I keep them for retrieving individual files if they were needed.

Quote:
- Floppy

That's a big + when using Ghost 2003--booting from a floppy drive can be a much easier solution than other possibilities--maybe not quite as fast in booting--but much greater flexibility!

Quote:
There is a possibility of a controller (Promise FastTrack (TX2?)/Ultra100) / HighPoint HotRod (66 iirc) / new) because of the single IDE but I'm praying all will be fine.

Personally, (and a lot depends on how you actually plan on using Ghost) I'd put a second IDE UDMA/ATA100 HDD on that controller, and switch to a SATA optical burner.  Use the first HDD to have my OS and other data partitions as needed, and use the second HDD to hold Ghost image files, etc.

But, if your intention is to burn Ghost images to optical discs, then it is not likely that Ghost 2003 would be compatible with a SATA optical burner--so be appropriately advised!

If you add a SATA HDD--that can be a problem for some systems and Ghost 2003!  Sometimes you have to change the SATA *mode* in the BIOS so it will run DOS based programs such as Ghost 2003.  Apparently SATA HDD controllers have been optimized to run under the newer NT based Windows OSs--but, then DOS fails! (Oh, the *details*!)

(Curiosity question--why not SATA HDD's in the first place (that is the current *latest and greatest* technology!)--other than the possibility they might cause some compatibility problems with DOS based programs?)

So, it's all *in the details* what will work--or not!  Most likely Ghost 2003 will be fine with WinXP--it was designed to work under that OS without trouble (although, most of the problems reported here are with the Windows Ghost interface--if something is going to go wrong, it's most likely to occur there!).  Having a floppy drive to boot from is a good thing--Ghost 2003's Boot Wizard can only create 1.44 MB boot floppy disks (you can possibly port those to bootable optical discs using various optical disc authoring programs).

Let us know how things work out!
 

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George
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Re: M4A79 Dlx and Ath II, single IDE and floppy, XP Pro Will It Work?
Reply #4 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 6:01pm
 
Quote:
Nice specs!


Especially when paired up with 4g of 1066 Mushkin 5-5-5-15!
I'll see how fast mine goes at a later date...right now it has an inexpensive Scythe hs and idles below mainboard temp by 3-4 degrees C (according to oem bios @ 1.4v though set at 1.25v; no c1e etc., though that's now on chip I believe)

Quote:
It's a little unclear as to how you intend to use Ghost.


The plan is to backup an image to dvd (using the one ide), as master, with the image boot switch and booting from floppy as I've done before.

I have Ghost from System Works 2001 boxed and Ghost 2003 boxed in addition to my newest version from the boxed version 10.0.
Pretty sure I've been using the 2001 version, but not the one from version 10 as I only just opened it.

- My main concern was that dos would have trouble with the new chipset, and the possibility that I'll have the SATA enabled at some point, through absent mindedness, and even though it shouldn't be involved in the cloning I'm sure having it enabled could cause trouble with Ghost.
This initial clone should have only the ide enabled.
- Also that I'll be doing this on one channel, hence the integrity check being extra important I should think!

I believe the last time I used Ghost it was with an LG, although I have NEC and Lite-on as well.

Quote:
If restores will always be to the same HDD, and only partition restores--then the restoring the Master Boot Tract will not be an issue!


I'd prefer to clone to a seperate hd but for two things.

- the lack of a seperate ide channel (rather not complicate things atm by involving SATA or a seperate controller)
- MS activation, I'll need to reactivate if I just try to swap in the cloned drive, correct? They're on dial up, I activte by phone, and in case anyone is beginning to wonder, it's all paid for.

Quote:
I've never been a fan of this concept of using Ghost images--*I'm installing Windows *clean* and I want an image of that pristine point in time so I can restore it if something goes wrong......*


- the main thing that has been going wrong is MS patches/updates messing up certain aspects of Corel, which my Mom prefers, so multiple clones at various stages of software installation with a seperate sata drive for file storage and e-sata for automated data backup, oh boy let the fun begin... ->

Quote:
Are you planning on putting all those OSs on the system?


This initial clone is XP activated with no additional software or patches.
Then:

1. install MS software
2. dl (seperate machine) Service Pack, patches and install
3. clone again
3. install Corel
4. install A.V.
5. clone again

Now here's where I have to make a decision, assuming the above order seems fine, do I install Win7Pro on a seperate partition or a seperate drive?
In the past Linux has helped with multiple O.S. on the same drive but for this I don't know if it would be advisable.

I'm leaning toward having XP and Win7 on the same drive with another drive with 2k and Linux. 2k for fall back for my parents and the Linux, in case all else fails, so that I can access any data left on messed up drives. There is always the possibility that someone will install some more software while I am away, as it were, and I have to leave an account there with elevated privileges precisely because I can't always be there.

Add to this the fact that I've not used Win7 at all and XP hardly at all. Though it is basically 2k... with, what's the expression, Xtra what?

I'm already complicating things enough, I think I need some clones of known good configurations.

To sum up.

1st drive with XP and Win7 (ide)
2nd drive with 2k and Linux (sata)
3rd drive for data (sata)

One e-sata for automated data backup

Clones of XP, then hopefully clone of XP and 7
 

- M4A79 Dlx, AthII  |   WD ide Seagate sata
- (btw, this machine rocks and is whisper quiet with 4 case/1mosfet  fans and 90x25 high pressure on the chip)
- Win7pro, XPpro, 2kpro, Linux
 
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George
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Toronto, On, ca


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Re: M4A79 Dlx and Ath II, single IDE and floppy, XP Pro Will It Work?
Reply #5 - Dec 17th, 2009 at 6:04pm
 
The original plan was 2k and XP on one ide drive, with Win7 on seperate drive.
A better plan but time constaints leave me with adding 2k and Linux at a later date, if at all.

Anyhow, thanks and let me know what you think, I'm getting ready to clone in the a.m.
 

- M4A79 Dlx, AthII  |   WD ide Seagate sata
- (btw, this machine rocks and is whisper quiet with 4 case/1mosfet  fans and 90x25 high pressure on the chip)
- Win7pro, XPpro, 2kpro, Linux
 
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George
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Toronto, On, ca


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- "Sure" switch = integrity check?
Reply #6 - Dec 18th, 2009 at 4:13pm
 
- "Sure" switch = integrity check?

Edit:
Installed 03 on a not so old machine, found the switch info (rtfm -crc  Embarrassed ), geuss I'm off to the races
thanks for your time!
/edit


I changed the process a little after remembering from past experiences.
It seems to have completed fine on a very recent model Lite-on.

Now I should have remembered that the "Sure" switch is absent - "Not available on this version" from the version I've been using which turns out to be Ghost 2002, from the '01 System Works. (I chose to try what worked for me before first, except for the burner)

-      I'm assuming this is the integrity check, no?
     Could somebody please verify this for me before I go and install an old version of ghost on a new machine?

Which leaves me with trying out '03 version, or Ghost 10, (newer is a problem due to a workplace injury - not serious though, just to my pocket book) seeing as how the computer will have sata along with a sata burner I might as well.
-      And maybe there is a way to verify, integrity check, from windows?

And of course I should have realized, as before, Ghost appears to be just ignoring the sata I've left enabled, again as before, on a NF2.
 

- M4A79 Dlx, AthII  |   WD ide Seagate sata
- (btw, this machine rocks and is whisper quiet with 4 case/1mosfet  fans and 90x25 high pressure on the chip)
- Win7pro, XPpro, 2kpro, Linux
 
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NightOwl
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tat..."

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Re: - "Sure" switch = integrity check?
Reply #7 - Dec 20th, 2009 at 10:37am
 
@
George

Been out of town last couple days--back now.....

Quote:
- "Sure" switch = integrity check?

Nope!  That switch is to make Ghost do its thing *automatically* without any user inputs--of course you have to have added the needed command line switches that tells Ghost exactly what to do--and if your commands are incorrect, then the results will also be incorrect!

So the *Sure* switch is telling Ghost that you are *positive* that you want Ghost to proceed without any further warnings or user inputs.

Quote:
Now I should have remembered that the "Sure" switch is absent - "Not available on this version" from the version I've been using which turns out to be Ghost 2002, from the '01 System Works.

The *Sure* switch is available on *all* versions of Ghost that uses the command line functionality--i.e. DOS based versions of Ghost.  The Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, and 15 are not based on the DOS version of Ghost, but on DriveImage by PowerQuest--it can not run in DOS and does not operate from the command line--so the *Sure* switch does not exist on those versions.

Quote:
I'm assuming this is the integrity check, no?

From the Ghost interface, you select *Local > Check > Image File*--you then navigate to the file you want to check and select it and follow the rest of the steps to do the *Integrity* check.

You can automate the Integrity check with an appropriate command line using the *-chkimg,filename* switch where *filename* would include the full path plus the Ghost file name--for example:

ghost.exe -chkimg,K:\Ghost_XP\1108\1108.GHO

Quote:
And maybe there is a way to verify, integrity check, from windows?

With Ghost 2003, you have a Windows interface where you can setup and begin the various Ghost procedures, but to actually do the procedure, Ghost will close down Windows, boot to DOS, do the procedure, and then boot back to Windows (if everything works without any glitches  Wink !)  Ghost 10 based on DriveImage is a Windows only based program, so an Integrity check can be done from within Windows because that's the only way it actually works!

Quote:
And of course I should have realized, as before, Ghost appears to be just ignoring the sata I've left enabled, again as before, on a NF2.

Ghost may or may not *ignore* SATA when you run the DOS based program.  The newer versions are SATA *aware*, and if a SATA controller is *seen*, it might try to mount that controller to determine if a HDD is attached--if Ghost is not compatible with that particular controller--or the controller is not set to be compatible with DOS based programs, then potentially Ghost could freeze when it attempts to communicate with the controller!

An older version of Ghost that is not SATA aware, would probably simply ignore the presence of the SATA controller--regardless of whether it's enabled, disabled and does or does not have a HDD connected.
 

____________________________________________________________________________________________

No question is stupid ... but, possibly the answers are Wink !
 
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