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Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE (Read 57408 times)
NightOwl-
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #30 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 2:33pm
 
Brian

You are the BartPE and ReatogoPE expert--is there a *plug-in* that once booted to one of these WinPE's, you can edit the Registry of the OS of the active, boot partition.

See where I'm going--if you have a Registry issue between your *MountedDevices* and the Ghost 10 RE--can you boot to BartPE, edit the *MountedDevices* to delete the key values, and then re-boot to the Ghost 10 RE and let it mount and assign drive letters on it's own without the conflict of attempting to use *sticky* drive letters from the Registry that are mismatched.
 

No question is stupid...but, possibly the answers are Wink !&&
 
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Pleonasm
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #31 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 3:08pm
 
NightOwl, concerning Reply #30, ERD Commander 2005 is a set of tools on a boot CD that claims to be able to edit the registry of a PC.  Unfortunately, it is no longer sold as a separate product, but only as part of an Administrator's Pak at USD$1,199.

Concerning Reply #29, the question is whether the reading of the registry from the active partition containing the operating system is a "design flaw" for the Ghost 10 recovery environment.  One could reasonably argue that such is true, since it creates the potential of a situation of not being able to see a partition containing the recovery point.  My point is that such a downside risk – in the minds of Symantec – may be offset by the increased 'ease-of-use' afforded to the naïve PC user by the consistency of drive letters in Windows XP and in the recovery environment in Windows PE.  Ideally, of course, one would expect a solution that accomplished both objectives.

A workaround approach to the problem we are discussing involves BartPE.  In the event that a user does not have visibility to a partition containing the recovery point while using the Ghost 10 recovery environment, it should be possible to boot using BartPE and simply copy the recovery point to another destination using the File Manager.
 

ple • o • nasm n. “The use of more words than are required to express an idea”
 
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John.
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #32 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 3:15pm
 
NightOwl wrote on Apr 9th, 2006 at 2:33pm:
is there a *plug-in* that once booted to one of these WinPE's, you can edit the Registry of the OS of the active, boot partition.

See my posting here about one registry add-in for BartPE:
http://radified.com/cgi-bin/YaBB/YaBB.cgi?board=general;action=display;num=11406...

It's a handy add-in that I have used to correct issues with client pc's that weren't able to boot.  I wouldn't recommend it though for casual editing.  You select the hives you want to load into memory, then modify and then resave the files.

For your hypothetical case:
1) If you're able to startup the xp system, just modify the registry directly.
2) If you're not able to startup the xp system, and you have problems with the RE, delete the corrupted os partition, and then reboot the RE.  According to your tests, all drives should re-appear.
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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NightOwl-
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #33 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 3:26pm
 
Pleonasm

Quote:
A workaround approach to the problem we are discussing involves BartPE.  In the event that a user does not have visibility to a partition containing the recovery point while using the Ghost 10 recovery environment, it should be possible to boot using BartPE and simply copy the recovery point to another destination using the File Manager.

Ah...excellent workaround!--but what a *pain in the butt*--you already spent the time saving that image to your external HDD, and now you have to spend more time transferring it elsewhere to access it--when it should simply be available when you boot to the Ghost 10 RE--better to simply not have Ghost 10 playing these *cute* games of trying to have drive letters in the RE match the drive letters from you WinXP environment.

If your external HDD's don't show up in the Ghost 10 RE--how has that made to poor *naïve PC user* better off  Wink !

But, still a viable workaround!

 

No question is stupid...but, possibly the answers are Wink !&&
 
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NightOwl-
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #34 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 3:54pm
 
Ghost4me

Quote:
2) If you're not able to startup the xp system, and you have problems with the RE, delete the corrupted os partition, and then reboot the RE.  According to your tests, all drives should re-appear.

Also excellent!!!--I'm betting that this should work too--probably even *easier* than Pleonasm's recommendation of copying the image files to a new location where they can be seen.

Quote:
I wouldn't recommend it though for casual editing.  You select the hives you want to load into memory, then modify and then resave the files.

Well, that's what I didn't know--I was hoping it would be a more friendly interface like what one sees in WinXP.

Would it be *hard* to explain to someone how to navigate the the *MountedDevices* key values so they can be deleted?
 

No question is stupid...but, possibly the answers are Wink !&&
 
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Brian
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #35 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 4:31pm
 
NightOwl wrote on Apr 9th, 2006 at 2:33pm:
--is there a *plug-in* that once booted to one of these WinPE's, you can edit the Registry of the OS of the active, boot partition.



NightOwl,

I looked at regedit in Reatogo BartPE and navigated to the MountedDevices keys. Alas, they are only for the BartPE OS and not for the installed WinXP.

John told me about Registry Editor PE but I haven't spent the time to learn how it works. John, could you provide a cookbook approach to get to those keys?
 
 
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #36 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 5:37pm
 
NightOwl wrote on Apr 9th, 2006 at 3:54pm:
Would it be *hard* to explain to someone how to navigate the the *MountedDevices* key values so they can be deleted?

Here's the instructions on how to just even get started with loading a remote registry using the Registry Editor PE for BartPE:
http://regeditpe.sourceforge.net/

As to how easy it would be to explain that to someone, you would first have to explain:
1) How to create BartPE setup from your Windows XP setup disc. (assuming the person has the Microsoft setup disc.)
2) How to add the Registry Editor add-in to BartPE.
3) How to burn and create the BartPE cd.

Then explain how to use the RegistryEditorPE plugin, navigate to the correct key(s), modify them, save the files, etc.

Compare that with how to explain to someone how to delete a corrupted partition.

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =

Brian wrote on Apr 9th, 2006 at 4:31pm:
John told me about Registry Editor PE but I haven't spent the time to learn how it works. John, could you provide a cookbook approach to get to those keys?

This has screenshots and the documentation:
http://regeditpe.sourceforge.net/

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


Observations (my 2 cents worth):


Let's not lose sight of the forest for the trees here.


We're talking about using an emergency boot RE cd because our normal XP operating system does not boot; it is corrupted and we want to restore the partition from a backup image stored on an external USB2 drive.

This is not an everyday occurrence.  It should not be attempted by a novice.  It would be like asking the question, "Can you give me steps on how to remove my appendix?"  What may be simple for a doctor, is not simple for the user.  Same applies I think to these advanced scenarios--nice to talk about at a doctor's (or PC) convention, but "don't try this at home".

Besides, this is a case where the external USB2 drive is not recognized properly by the RE cd.  It could all be a moot point soon, when/if Microsoft or Symantec recognizes the problem.

And it's not like the issue of getting USB2 drives to work in DOS.  In DOS and Ghost 2003 you have no support for USB2 drives at all.  The user must use a trial and error approach to finding something that works with his DOS diskette (or cd) and his external USB drive.  In that case finding a driver that works is necessary just to get the Ghost 2003 backup imaging process to backup to USB, much less the emergency restore.

With Ghost 10 fortunately, there doesn't seem to be any issue or problem of creating the backup image.  There's not an issue or problem of accessing the backup image from within XP.  The issue is the stand-alone recovery environment setup by the boot cd.

If someone called me on the phone and wanted over-the-phone instructions on how to restore their hard drive (remove their appendix), I would be hard pressed to give it.  Too risky.  Most likely I would say make an appointment and I'll come look at it.

Exchanging detailed instructions on a technical forum such as this is great.  But I wouldn't try to explain any of this to a someone.  Yes it is too hard to explain to somone (in my opinion).

[The opinions expressed here are those of the author.  Your mileage and opinions may vary.]
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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John.
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #37 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 6:47pm
 
One final point or consideration that I failed to mention:

Most of the discoveries of the Ghost 10 issues with some configurations of external USB drives, occurs BECAUSE the user is testing the RE cd
before it is actually needed
during an emergency.

That is a good thing!
 It means that one can prescribe several non-invasive procedures that will likely fix the problem without involving surgery on the registry, resetting the USB2 disk DiskID, BartPE or other measures.  That would likely involve simply:

1.) Rename the USB2 drive to a lower drive letter, using Disk Management in XP.
2.) Removing other USB2 devices (card readers etc.) before booting from the RE cd.

These two simple steps have resolved probably at least 75% of the cases brought to this forum for help.

Other cases have dealt with SATA drivers, motherboard drivers, etc. which is a completely different subject.

Not minimizing the need for the RE cd to work in all cases, but whenever you recognize the problem BEFOREHAND, as we've seen, most of them are easily solved.  Because you are operating from an operational XP environment.
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #38 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 7:02pm
 
Ghost4me

Very good points.

I struggled with how to present this material in the first place--it is mind numbing--unless you enjoy the *technical puzzle* it presents--I'm sure there have been many who have abandoned this thread for that very reason...

But, I proceeded anyway because I know we are going to have folks show up here that say, "I installed Ghost 10 and have been creating back up images for x months and stored them on my external HDD.  I installed a program yesterday, it screwed up my system, and now I can't boot to my WinXP OS.  I booted the Ghost RE and my external HDD does not appear there--I can not access my backup image to restore and recover a functional OS--HELP ME PLEASE!"

So far, your feedback seems to offer the easiest way to help someone recover--if they are to the point of needing to restore their OS partition with a backup image--and they can not *see* their external HDD's in the Ghost 10 RE.

But, the other part of what I wanted to accomplish here, was to *know thy enemy*, so one can be prepared before the fact, and that's what I'm going to summarize in my *Conclusion and Recommendations*--if you know what can go wrong and why--it's easy to make a few changes now to avoid issues under duress and emergency conditions  Wink .
 

No question is stupid...but, possibly the answers are Wink !&&
 
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Brian
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #39 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 7:11pm
 
John. wrote on Apr 9th, 2006 at 5:37pm:
This has screenshots and the documentation:
http://regeditpe.sourceforge.net/



John,

I followed the instructions but I can't load the relevant MountedDevices. It doesn't really matter as I wouldn't use this approach anyway. I think your suggestion of deleting the partition is a lot easier.
 
 
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #40 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 7:33pm
 
Brian wrote on Apr 9th, 2006 at 7:11pm:
I followed the instructions but I can't load the relevant MountedDevices. It doesn't really matter as I wouldn't use this approach anyway. I think your suggestion of deleting the partition is a lot easier.

Brian,
Did you integrate the Registry Edit PE into you BartPE and then burn a new BartPE CD?

I just printed out the instructions again, and went through them carefully.  I booted into my BartPE cd, started the RegistryEditorPE program.

Each step of 1) through 7) guessed the correct hive name to load, so it was a matter of just clicking "yes" several times to get through step 7).

I loaded my own user profile, following steps 8) through 9b).  Be sure to highlight ntuser.dat file in \documents and settings\youruserid\ and then click Open in 9b).

It then loads the registry hives and your user profile.  You can then navigate (much like regedit) to:
My Computer\HKLM\
_REMOTE_SYSTEM
\System\MountedDevices and see the entries.

Follow step 13) to close and save.

By the way, I tested and tried several other off-line registry hive editors and this one was much more straight forward than any other I tested.

Want to try again with these instructions?  I think you will be pleasantly surprised.
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #41 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 7:40pm
 
John, I did that. But the keys in MountedDevices are for BartPE rather than for WinXP. Have I missed something?
 
 
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #42 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 7:53pm
 
Brian, did you load your remote-user-profile also?  If so you should be able to look at a few registry entries that you can confirm are from the correct registry.  Also, were the file names (SAM, SECURITY, software, system) highlighted at each step and you selected open?  Plus the initial Windows directory from c: ?

All this *should* work.

Look in
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software and see if all the sub-keys there are the ones from your REAL xp system, or are they the BartPE ones?

 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #43 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 8:11pm
 
NightOwl wrote on Apr 9th, 2006 at 7:02pm:
"I installed Ghost 10 and have been creating back up images for x months and stored them on my external HDD.  I installed a program yesterday, it screwed up my system, and now I can't boot to my WinXP OS.  I booted the Ghost RE and my external HDD does not appear there--I can not access my backup image to restore and recover a functional OS--HELP ME PLEASE!"


The simplest answer is still delete the partition (many easy ways to do this) and retry.

However, I would NEVER tell someone to delete their *possibly* only partially (or totally) corrupt os partition BEFORE I verified that there was really a true verifiable restorable Ghost image on the backup.

That's why I would insist on examining the system myself first.

A safer approach would be to remove the failed/corrupt drive, put a new blank drive in, and restore the Ghost image backup to that one, if possible.  If not, I would then take the corrupt drive and install it inside a separate known good xp pc as an additional drive, and manually recover the critical customer files.

I am still having difficulties accepting the any recovery environment emergency boot cd reads files from the host pc disk drive, if present.  If someone told me they had an emergency boot DOS diskette that did this, I would say the same thing.

(I know I may be a born skeptic, but ... I am.)
 

Ghost4me  Ghost 9, 10, 12, 14, 15.  Windows XP, Vista, Windows 7
 
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Re: Missing External HDD's in Ghost 10's RE
Reply #44 - Apr 9th, 2006 at 8:20pm
 
John. wrote on Apr 9th, 2006 at 7:53pm:
Brian, did you load your remote-user-profile also?



I did everything correctly but, duh, I looked for the subkeys in System rather than _Remote_System. You are correct. Now I know how to do it, it is easy.
 
 
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