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RAM size, speed and timing (plus other things that came up) (Read 5975 times)
Christer
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RAM size, speed and timing (plus other things that came up)
Feb 23rd, 2016 at 5:06am
 
Hello all!

I'm planning to upgrade from W7 to W10. In preparation, I'm planning to upgrade the RAM from 4 GB to either 8 GB or 16 GB. I don't play games and do no photoshopping or video editing, just Office work. The most RAM-intensive task I do is ... Roll Eyes ... Windows Update! This means that the system probably won't benefit from 16 GB over 8 GB but I have a doubts about that.

The motherboard supports 1333 MHz without OC and that's what I'm opting for.

1333 MHz modules are hard to find but the 1600 MHz modules listed below are SPD at 1333 MHz.

Comparing CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9 and CMZ8GX3M2A1600C8

Can the C8 modules be set to run at 1333 MHz with the lower latency or is that possible at 1600 MHz only? If possible, would I notice a difference worth a 34% price increase?

Would it be better to go for CMZ16GX3M2A1600C9G (disregard the colour) at a 65% price premium over the 8 GB C9 modules?
 

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Brian
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #1 - Feb 23rd, 2016 at 1:20pm
 
@
Christer

My son and I both have 16 GB of Corsair Vengeance DDR3 RAM. I don't game and my RAM usage maxes out at 4 GB. I'll check with my son who does game.

I don't know the answers to your technical questions.

When it comes to the upgrade from W7 to W10, don't bother about having all the Windows updates done. You can upgrade from a fresh W7 install (no updates) to W10. It makes no difference to the final W10.

Edit... my son says 8 GB has been his maximum usage.

 
 
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Christer
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #2 - Feb 23rd, 2016 at 4:37pm
 
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Brian

Neither do I have an answer to the technical questions but I went google on it and came to the conclusion that if it would be possible to run at 1333 MHz and CL8, it would be difficult to notice any difference compared to CL9 during normal usage. Maybe benchmarking would show a difference but probably negligible.

I have wondered what the fuss is about the requirement of a fully updated W7 prior to doing the upgrade to W10. I didn't understand why and you have confirmed my suspicion that it's not a prerequisite. Maybe IE11 is a prerequiste update if the installer only provides Edge?

My RAM usage has maxed out at 4GB and it was when running Windows Update (bloody disaster). Other than that, 2GB but that's on W7. I'm not in a tight spot financially so I can afford 16GB and stop worrying ...  Undecided ... until I start worrying about having wasted my money ...  Roll Eyes ... !
 

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Christer
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #3 - Feb 23rd, 2016 at 4:45pm
 
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Brian

I'm currently dual booting WXP and W7. I hope that the upgrade will become a dual boot of WXP and W10. If I like W10 and decide to not revert to WXP/W7, the I'll get an SSD and do a fresh installation of W10, no more WXP. The SSD will probably provide a much higher performance boost than any RAM timings.

(I wonder if Ghost 2003, booted from a floppy, will create and restore images of W10 but that's another thread.)
 

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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #4 - Feb 23rd, 2016 at 7:10pm
 
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Christer

Christer wrote on Feb 23rd, 2016 at 4:37pm:
I have wondered what the fuss is about the requirement of a fully updated W7 prior to doing the upgrade to W10. 


It is required if you update from Windows Update. But if you update from a Win10 UFD or DVD (in Windows) no Win7 updates are required.

Win10 will contain IE 11 and Edge.
 
 
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #5 - Feb 23rd, 2016 at 7:47pm
 
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Christer

Christer wrote on Feb 23rd, 2016 at 4:45pm:
I wonder if Ghost 2003, booted from a floppy, will create and restore images of W10


Ghost 2003 was run from a DOS USB flash drive. The Win10 partition was 1MiB aligned. MBR/Legacy system.

Image created and restored to the same partition. Win10 loaded normally.

The same image was restored to a new, empty HD. All Free Space.
Win10  booted to a BSOD, Error code:0xc0000225
A BCD Edit was run from BIBM. Win10 loaded normally.

So, it's OK to use your 13 year old imaging app on Win10 in a MBR system.


 
 
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Christer
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #6 - Feb 24th, 2016 at 2:27am
 
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Brian

Quote:
It is required if you update from Windows Update. But if you update from a Win10 UFD or DVD (in Windows) no Win7 updates are required.


I guess that is to reduce the download during an online upgrade.

Quote:
The Win10 partition was 1MiB aligned. MBR/Legacy system.


Is that a deviation from the standard setup during a fresh installation of W10?
 

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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #7 - Feb 24th, 2016 at 11:42am
 
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Christer wrote on Feb 24th, 2016 at 2:27am:
Is that a deviation from the standard setup during a fresh installation of W10?      

When you install Win10 to Unallocated Free Space the partition will be 1MiB aligned as that is the partitioner default. It's been the default since Vista. Ghost 2003 doesn't understand 1MiB alignment (2048 sector alignment) and that's why restoring the image to Unallocated Free Space failed. Ghost restored the image and created a Cylinder aligned partition. The failure could have been prevented by "generalizing" the BCD prior to creating the image. If you restore the image to an established partition, either Cylinder or 1MiB aligned, no problem.
 
 
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #8 - Feb 24th, 2016 at 1:23pm
 
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Brian

Quote:
It's been the default since Vista.


When installing Win 7, I had the harddisk prepartitioned from within XP (which was installed first) to get the partitions cylinder aligned and I run Ghost with the -fdsp switch. I have wondered if that (cylinder aligned contra 1MiB aligned) renders a performance hit?

Could the same approach be used while installing W10 from scratch? I mean, if I upgrade the current system from W7 to W10, that would be the case, sort of.
 

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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #9 - Feb 24th, 2016 at 1:57pm
 
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Christer

Christer wrote on Feb 24th, 2016 at 1:23pm:
Could the same approach be used while installing W10 from scratch? I mean, if I upgrade the current system from W7 to W10, that would be the case, sort of. 


Yes, your cylinder aligned partition will still be cylinder aligned when you upgrade Win7 to Win10. As you mentioned, if you create a cylinder aligned partition and clean install Win10 into that partition it will remain cylinder aligned.

I don't think you will have performance issues unless you have a SSD or an Advanced Format HD.
 
 
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Christer
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #10 - Feb 24th, 2016 at 3:19pm
 
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Brian

Quote:
I don't think you will have performance issues unless you have a SSD or an Advanced Format HD.


Sooner or later, I'll migrate the system to a SSD and will probably not involve XP in any way during the clean installation which means 1 MiB alignment.
 

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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #11 - Feb 24th, 2016 at 3:52pm
 
Installing Win10 from a UFD to a SSD is fast. About 10 minutes.
 
 
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Christer
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #12 - Feb 25th, 2016 at 2:51am
 
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Brian

I have read a little about SSD performance but it's still a grey zone for me. As I understand it, formatting a SSD from within XP, to circumvent the limitations of Ghost 2003, is not a good idea.

Which SSD in the 250-500 GB range do you recommend?
 

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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #13 - Feb 25th, 2016 at 4:28pm
 
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No, you don't want WinXP creating Cylinder aligned partitions on a SSD. Performance reasons.

As far as SSD recommendations, it depends who you ask. I have Intel 520 and 530 series SSDs. (the current series is 535) They are reliable and fast but not inexpensive. 5 year warranty. I also have 2 el cheapo SanDisk SSDs which are fine too.

Regarding size. It depends how much data you intend to put on the SSD. I use small OS partitions and keep my data files on an internal HD. In this computer my Win10 partition is 40 GB with 15 GB of free space. The SSD is 240 GB and contains about 10 bootable partitions. I certainly don't need a larger SSD.
 
 
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Re: RAM size, speed and timing
Reply #14 - Feb 26th, 2016 at 12:00am
 
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Christer

Christer wrote on Feb 23rd, 2016 at 5:06am:
I'm planning to upgrade from W7 to W10. In preparation, I'm planning to upgrade the RAM from 4 GB to either 8 GB or 16 GB. I don't play games and do no photoshopping or video editing, just Office work. The most RAM-intensive task I do is ... Roll Eyes ... Windows Update! This means that the system probably won't benefit from 16 GB over 8 GB but I have a doubts about that.

There's another variable that you may have to take into account--at least with Win7 and older WinXP--in order to have the OS actually *see*, and use more than 3.49 GB of RAM, you have to be using a 64 bit installed version of the OS.

At the time I purchased my most recent motherboard (it's getting to be *old* now--4-5 years ago!), I specifically decided not to invest in more than 4 GB of RAM because I knew that Win7 would not see more than that 3.49 GB if I installed the 32 bit version of Win7--and at least at that time, using 64 bit Win7 was still not getting the best reviews--many poor compatibility issues with too many software titles.

I don't know if that's an issue with Win10?  I don't know if there is both a 32 bit and a 64 bit version--or if Win10 is only 64 bit now?

And, you probably will not have to worry about Windows Update *churning* your system--with Win10, if I understand correctly, you don't get any choice in the matter as to what update(s) you are going to get--you're force feed, and that's it!
 

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