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Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9) (Read 15843 times)
br549
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Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Aug 27th, 2005 at 8:14pm
 
Hi all.....

I am new here and to newer versions of Ghost.  The last version that I used was back in the 1990,s and I don't remember what version.

I work at a school and I guess you could call me the resident tech ( I remember dos), at least for our building. We just received 25 pcs (Dell) loaded with various programs (each 5 has a different set).  I would like to ghost to image each different type of pc in case we have a crash (we are prone to that with all of the students) and am not sure what to do. I have ghost 2002 and can get version 9 (or 2003) if I need to.

?  I have done some research and see that version 9 has problems because of imaging while live ( makes sense to me) and that there is a reatogo build with a version 9 plugin.

My questions are

1. If I make the reatogo cd from a machine loaded with version 9 can I run it on another machine without version 9 on it?  I could go back and load later this would just help me get the labs going.

2. Will version 2002 make a image for backup across both the XP file system (NTFS) and fat32?  I found a post saying that it would after upgrade (no longer on web-site) and others where it would not.

3. Would I be better off with 2003 as it seems to be what most of you are using?

All backups would either be to a usb key, external HD, or a CD.

Thanks for the help and feel free to offer any other advice that you think might help. We will of course buy all license needed to do this.

James
 
 
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Rad
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #1 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 10:28pm
 
Brian will be by to help you. He is the resident BartPE guru.
 
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br549
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #2 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 11:26pm
 
Ok...Thanks

 
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #3 - Aug 28th, 2005 at 1:43am
 
br549,

I can only reply for Ghost 9 and the Reatogo CD. Ghost 9 can image partitions while Windows is running but can't do any imaging at all from the boot CD (Recovery Environment). I like this live imaging feature, others don't. Reatogo BartPE/Ghost 9 CD can do imaging from the Recovery Environment without needing to have Ghost 9 installed on your computer.

The license issue is for you to sort out but this is what I suggest.

Install Ghost 9 on one of your computers. It doesn't matter which one. Make the Reatogo CD. You can decide whether you need Ghost 9 installed on all computers for future imaging. This could be done now or later.

Use the Reatogo CD to image the C: drive of each of your five classes of computer. Don't bother imaging the other Dell partitions. I usually delete them as they aren't essential. So, a total of five images. I'd write the images direct to your external HD (don't forget to tick Verify) as that is the quickest way . You can burn to DVD later if you desire your images on two different backup media. Don't use CD's as restoring from multiple CD's would be torture.

I'd imagine your images will be less than 4 GB but if they are larger and you think they won't fit on a single DVD, then choose a split size of 4480 MB.

Should be straight forward. Good luck.

http://radified.com/cgi-bin/YaBB/YaBB.cgi?board=general;action=display;num=11192...


Any questions?
 
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #4 - Aug 28th, 2005 at 2:52am
 
If you can create & restore images with Ghost 9 from the BartPE CD, that's worth noting in the guide.

Any nuances I should be aware of?

Other than the license issue?
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #5 - Aug 28th, 2005 at 4:39am
 
All Ghost 9 functions can be done from the Reatogo BartPE/Ghost 9 CD. Create and Restore images, image to and restore from a network share, write an image to DVD but two optical drives are needed, browse images and restore individual files. It is more user friendly than the Ghost 9 Recovery Environment and has the same appearance as the Windows component of Ghost 9.

Multiple plugins can be run from the same CD, some relevant, others less so. You can even surf the net using Firefox from a computer without a hard drive. Deleting the "undeletable file" is very handy.
 
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #6 - Aug 28th, 2005 at 10:42am
 
Brian

I do have a couple of questions.

1. If I make the cd with the Reatogo/Ghost 9 I am assuming it will see the usb ports?  I think all of these new machines will boot from a usb key.

2. Is there anything I need to do tho burn the images to a DVD from the external hard drive other than a normal copy?  I think (I have read so much my mind is in overload) someone said that there was a certain way to image the machines.

Thanks for the reply.  I am going to try a cd today so I am sure there will be more questions.

James
 
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #7 - Aug 28th, 2005 at 11:26am
 
James, plug your USB external HD into the port before you boot to the Reatogo CD. The external HD will be seen from Reatogo. I have no experience booting from a USB key.

Nothing special about burning the images but if they are larger than 2 GB (probably will be) then choose UDF format, not UDF/ISO. I use Nero.

The images can be split into smaller chunks later if there is a problem. Ghost Backup Image Browser can do this.
 
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #8 - Aug 28th, 2005 at 8:08pm
 
James,

You needn't read this until you have to restore one of the 4 computers that wasn't imaged. If that ever needs to be done. So you should make a note of which computers were imaged.

http://www.sysinternals.com/Utilities/NewSid.html

I've never done it so I'm unlikely to be able to answer questions on computer SID's.
 
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #9 - Aug 29th, 2005 at 12:46pm
 
Updated the guide to note you can use a BartPE bootable CD/DVD to *create* (and restore) images, which would give you the same environment for both operations, which would make me more comfortable.

http://ghost.radified.com/norton_ghost_90.htm
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #10 - Aug 29th, 2005 at 2:16pm
 
Rad, I looked at your text describing Ghost 9.0 (http://ghost.radified.com/norton_ghost_90.htm) that was referenced in the prior thread, and in the spirit of accuracy, I recommend that you consider making the following corrections:

"Another concern is that Symantec is unable to update the version of Ghost contained on the Restore CD (the ghost.exe executable).": 

(A)  "Unable" isn't quite accurate.  I do not see any technical reason why Symantec could not disseminate a patch (or new version) of the Restore CD, in the event that a problem was discovered.  To-date, this has not proven to be necessary.
(B) In fairness, I recommend that you also make clear that Ghost 2003 hasn't had an update in several years, and is quite unlikely to be updated at any point in the future.  While in theory Ghost 2003 could be updated, in practice the likelihood is nil.  At minimum, the Restore CD for Ghost 9.0 is updated annually, whereas the same cannot be claimed for Ghost 2003.

"Symantec did not convert their Corporate version of Ghost to the Windows-based (Drive Image-based) application": 
This is simply inaccurate.  The 'corporate' version of Ghost 9.0 is the Symantec LiveState Recovery suite of applications.  In fact, if you go to the Symantec website, you'll see that Symantec doesn't even list the corporate version of Ghost 2003 any longer as an option within its solution set for "Backup and Disaster Recovery" (http://enterprisesecurity.symantec.com/content/productlink.cfm).

Ghost 9.0 "requires you to install Microsoft's .Net bloatware": 
True, but you should be aware that .NET is the underlying framework of Windows Vista which Microsoft is using to incorporate a Service Oriented Architecture (SOA) structure into the new operating system (called Indigo; see http://msdn.microsoft.com/windowsvista/support/lhdevfaq/indigo.aspx#a4e7myrr).&n...; Thus, far from being a disadvantage, Ghost 9.0 is already a long way toward compatibility with Windows Vista.  As noted in another thread, it is quite unlikely that Ghost 2003 will work with Windows Vista if either Full Volume Encryption (http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/system/platform/pcdesign/secure-start_tech.mspx) or WinFS (http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/dnwinfs/html/wi...) is utilized.

Kind regards,
Pleonasm
 
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #11 - Aug 30th, 2005 at 12:01am
 
Ah, Pleo,

We all need someone to keep us honest. For that I thank you.

Give me a few days to examine your comments, and I will modify my text as appropriate.
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #12 - Aug 30th, 2005 at 1:41am
 
Pleonasm  

Your defence of Ghost 9.x is admirable--but read this comment by *
clevelandtxus
* here:

Ghost 9 - BSOD!


Quote:
I do not see any technical reason why Symantec could not disseminate a patch (or new version) of the Restore CD, in the event that a problem was discovered.  To-date, this has not proven to be necessary.


Evidence exists that *there is/are (a) problem(s)*--but, Symantec is not addressing it (them)!

What good ia the *ability* to update a program, if they don't exercise it?
 

No question is stupid...but, possibly the answers are Wink !&&
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #13 - Aug 30th, 2005 at 7:36pm
 
NightOwl, the BSOD problem reported by clevelandtxus is in reference to booting the PC after installing Ghost 9.0 - it is not in reference to using the Recovery Environment CD disc.  Therefore, the issue of Symantec's ability (or willingness) to distribute a patch for the Recovery Environment CD is not applicable in this case.

Nonetheless, your general point is well taken.  I do not claim that either Symantec or any of their products are without defects.  In fact, I would go so far as to say that I am not personally aware of any major application by any software manufacturer that is completely fault free.  I trust you will agree that Ghost 2003 has its own collection of known defects - as documented in the postings in this forum - which Symantec has ignored by failing to disseminate any updates whatsoever for Ghost 2003 for several years.

As frustrating as the BSOD issue is for those who experience it, I think it is worthwhile to put this in perspective.  Since Drive Image 7 reported that over 1 million copies were in use, let's conservatively assume that there are 1 million copies of Ghost 9.0 in use.  In looking at the BSOD thread, there are - let's say - 10 individuals who have reported that problem.  If only 1 in 100 actually takes the time to report the issue, then there are approximately 10,000 individuals experiencing this difficulty.  That is 1% of the total user base for Ghost 9.0 - and that estimate is probably quite high, given my lax assumptions.

I am not trying to justify a programming defect, only trying to note that the BSOD problem is not commonplace.  If it were, then forum boards like this one would be inundated with postings on the subject.

Why hasn't Symantec fixed this problem?  Probably for the same reason that Symantec hasn't fixed various problems with Ghost 2003:  namely, with limited resources, they are focusing on delivering the greatest good for the greatest number of users rather than repairing niche issues.

I sincerely hope that Symantec does address the BSOD issue in Ghost 10.0, together with all other known issues.
 
 
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Re: Ghost and BartPE (2002 or 9)
Reply #14 - Aug 31st, 2005 at 11:17am
 
NightOwl, a description of a sample of known defects in Ghost 2003 will be found in the following Symantec Knowledge Base articles:
  • Ghost compatibility with USB cables

  • Error: "19205 Compression error -4" while creating a spanned or split image

  • How to troubleshoot problems when writing to CD-R and CD-RW drives

  • Ghost cannot see a drive or partition in the drive selection window
Symantec hasn't fixed these (plus other) problems with Ghost 2003 – and probably never will.  I offered my viewpoint on why such is the case, but I would appreciate hearing your perspective on why Symantec has the ability to issue an update for Ghost 2003 but has not done so.

Additionally, allow me to suggest that the BSOD difficulty reported in conjunction with Ghost 9.0 may not necessarily be a problem with Ghost 9.0 per se.  To illustrate, consider that Chris Skory reported the "PQI file problem" (see thread "Ghost 9.0 gives an error for undocumented PQI file"), but as a consequence of my post, he determined that the difficulty really was due to an improper BIOS setting – and changing that setting made the "Ghost 9.0 problem" disappear.  Some (certainly not all) problems that appear to be defects with Ghost 9.0 may in fact be occurring as a result of interactions with other installed software and/or hardware configurations.  Troubleshooting requires an open mind, and to entertain the possibility that the source of the problem is not where you think.  The lesson:  it is probably wise to initially avoid assuming that a problem in using Ghost 9.0 is in fact due to a defect in Ghost 9.0.  (In contrast to Ghost 2003, the Symantec Knowledge Base contains no articles describing "known problems" with Ghost 9.0.)
 
 
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