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A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More! (Read 386848 times)
Jim flournoy
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #75 - Aug 11th, 2005 at 4:54pm
 
Hello everyone -
I found this thread and website  by googling "ghost usb 2" and have found it very helpful!  Thank you all for the wonderful tutorial.   Cheesy

Using the steps in the very first post of this thread (but with v2.20 of Panasonic Universal USB Driver) I am cloning to my external at a pretty good clip, but I'm still not as fast as some of the other users.  I'm maxing out at about 478 MB/min while imaging to USB HD, but USB 2 (and my enclosure) should still be alot faster.  The spec for USB 2 (and my enclosure) is 480MB/sec (per second!!) 

Can anyone think of a way to get this any faster?  If I could get into the 1000 or 1500 MB/min or faster that would be awesome!

For the record, here is my gear:

PC:  Dell Dimension 3000, P4, 3.0 GHz CPU, 800 MB FSB, 512 MB RAM, 80 GB HD

USB Enclosure:  An Ultra ULT-31310 Combo (USB 2 / IEEE1394) to IDE, with enclosed Maxtor DiamondMax 250 GB EIDE HD, 7200/16MB/ATA-133 

Regards,
Jim
 
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #76 - Aug 11th, 2005 at 6:13pm
 
Quote:
"... but I'm still not as fast as some of the other users.  I'm maxing out at about 478 MB/min while imaging to USB HD, but USB 2 (and my enclosure) should still be alot faster.  The spec for USB 2 (and my enclosure) is 480MB/sec (per second!!)  

Can anyone think of a way to get this any faster?  If I could get into the 1000 or 1500 MB/min or faster that would be awesome!...

The surname 'Flournoy' is evocative of Caddo Parish, Louisiana - but, nevermind, let's get down to business:

USB 2.0 = 480 Mbps (megaBITS per second) = 60 MB/s (megaBYTES per second)
Roll Eyes

I don't know what you mean by 'maxing-out', but I do know that on my Dell Dimension 8300 I can use Fast Compression in a Norton Ghost 2003 "disk-to-image" Backup procedure to generate seven 2GB spanned images in less than 15 minutes with my SATA-150 external HDD; my best USB 2.0 rig will take 25-to-28 minutes to do the same job.

El_Pescador wrote on May 21st, 2005 at 4:16pm:
"... The Intel USB host controller drivers typically found on motherboards can cause greater expense to rectify than employing a communications tactic using tomorrow's technology rather than that from yesterday; the SATA hardware of the future will be backwards compatible just like USB 2.0 hardware is with USB 1.1:

USB 2.0 = 480 Mbps (megaBITS per second) = 60 MB/s (megaBYTES per second)

FireWire 400 = 400 Mbps (megaBITS per second)

FireWire 800 = 800 Mbps (megaBITS per second)

SATA = 1,500 Mbps (megaBITS per second)

SATA II = 3,000 Mbps (megaBITS per second)

SATA III = 6,000 Mbps (megaBITS per second)

SATA has no host controller/device controller baggage like either USB 2.0 or FireWire, i.e., a PC system categorizes both USB and FireWire devices as external whereas an external SATA device - despite its own power supply and its own cooling fan - is regarded as internal. BTW, you can readily boot from an internal SATA HDD mounted in an external enclosure kit as referred to below - try to do that without major USB issues or minor FireWire issues.  So, consider 'thinking outside the box'..."

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Jim Flournoy
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #77 - Aug 12th, 2005 at 5:15am
 
El-
By "maxing out at 478 MB/min" I just meant this is the speed at which I ghost the USB image.

I see your point about the difference between MB/s and Mbps, but still 60 MB/s is much faster than 478 MB/minute

60 MB/s = 3600 MB/min

therefore, I'm still getting only 478/3600 or 13% of the USB 2 standard.  Thats the number I'd like to improve on. 

How much RAM are you running in your 8300 to get those speeds?  Do you think RAM is a factor in this? 

BTW - TX, OK, and MO, but I don't know any in LA...
Jim
 
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #78 - Aug 12th, 2005 at 10:57am
 
Jim Flournoy

Quote:
therefore, I'm still getting only 478/3600 or 13% of the USB 2 standard.


USB is a Windows *standard*--not a DOS standard--based on most peoples' posts and own experience--you are getting about what most folks report for speed with USB 2.0.

I suspect that it is more likely *CPU cycles* rather than RAM that is the critical factor in DOS UBS performance--but I'm guessing on that one.
 

No question is stupid...but, possibly the answers are Wink !&&
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #79 - Aug 12th, 2005 at 11:54am
 
Quote:
"... 'maxing out at 478 MB/min' I just meant this is the speed at which I ghost the USB image...
BTW - TX, OK, and MO, but I don't know any in LA..."
I don't understand exactly how you are deriving '478 MB/min', i.e., with my best USB device I usually start off around 1,500-to-1,700 and taper off to 550-to-650 nearing completion.  So, is '478 MB/min' a snapshot value or a result of some sort of calculation - please explain.

I have two 512MB sticks of primo OCZ for RAM in the 8300, but I agree with NightOwl about the CPU cycles.  I have three Dell Dimension desktops on my LAN - 8300, 8100, L400c - and, despite being maxed out at 512MB RAM, the L400c Celeron just positively oozes along in Ghost 2003.

To see how I have managed to improve performance with FAT32 partitions in Ghost 2003, CLICK HERE. This refers to both internal SLAVE HDDs and to external HDDs connected via USB, FireWire and SATA.

BTW - Caddo Parish (Shreveport), LA adjoins TX and AR with OK nearby to the northwest and MO on far side of AR to the north.  J. Howell Flournoy was the High Sheriff for decades when I was a youngster, and Flournoy was a well-respected family name throughout the parish back then.  I moved away almost 40 years ago, but the community is still close to my heart.

El Pescador

 

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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #80 - Aug 12th, 2005 at 2:29pm
 
Quote:
"... Using the steps in the very first post of this thread (but with v2.20 of Panasonic Universal USB Driver) I am cloning to my external at a pretty good clip, but I'm still not as fast as some of the other users...

For the record, here is my gear:

PC:  Dell Dimension 3000, P4, 3.0 GHz CPU, 800 MB FSB, 512 MB RAM, 80 GB HD

USB Enclosure:  An Ultra ULT-31310 Combo (USB 2 / IEEE1394) to IDE, with enclosed Maxtor DiamondMax 250 GB EIDE HD, 7200/16MB/ATA-133..."

I am assuming your highly-rated external enclosure kit would not function in Ghost 2003 with the stock Norton/Iomega drivers extracted from Guest.exe, and that is a puzzle.  Do consider that all three of my Macally USB 2.0 PHR-series work just fine with all brands of IDE HDDs up 120GB, but my 160GB Seagate requires NightOwl's Panasonic Universal USB Driver routine (CLICK HERE to view using same inside Windows) to function whereas my 160GB Maxtor does not.

Therefore: (1) I wonder if the 250GB volume of your DiamondMax is an issue; and (2) have you ever used FireWire during your Ghosting sessions?

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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #81 - Aug 18th, 2005 at 6:22pm
 
EL - Thanks again for the tips.  I guess I can live with the speeds I'm getting.  You're right about the speed starting off around much faster, about 1500 MB/min and taper off to around 500 at the end.  It seems that I always want to push it faster when I can! 

As far as the talk about CPU cycles, that is not changeable in my dell, right?  I didn't see anyway in Bios to change it. I saw somewhere that the memory speed is 333, even though I run PC3200

As far as your question about the Guest.exe drivers, I never tried those.  The only thing I've taken from Ghost 2003 is the ghost.exe, and that is how I'm ghosting (of course with the panasonic drivers.) 

Anyway, thanks again. 

Jim
 
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #82 - Aug 19th, 2005 at 11:22am
 
Quote:
"... about CPU cycles, that is not changeable in my dell..."

You could do what David_L6 does... buy Dell parts and components off eBay and swap out your CPU ... LOL !!! I'm serious - he really does.

Quote:
"... As far as your question about the Guest.exe drivers, I never tried those.  The only thing I've taken from Ghost 2003 is the ghost.exe, and that is how I'm ghosting (of course with the panasonic drivers.)..."

The first table below illustrates USB 2.0 host controller specifications while the second does likewise for USB 2.0 device controllers.  If you are up to taking a shot at it, how about performing some trials for us and reporting back so I can flesh out these tables with specifications from your rig?

...

...

From what I can tell up to now, USB 2.0 host controllers for desktop PCs have eventually shaken out to either
VID=8086h
or
VID=1033h
- and no other thusfar.  So, what I am now able to do with a fair degree of certainty is counsel someone as to: (1) whether or not they will need a PCI-to-USB Host Adapter Card despite having USB 2.0 ports on their systemboard - and which model cards are compliant with Ghost 2003 operations; and (2) whether or not adopting NightOwl's Panasonic Universal USB Drivers routine will render their hitherto incompatible external enclosure kit Ghost 2003-compatible.

On the host end of the "bridge", the useful items are in properties of only those terminal "branch(es)" on the Universal Serial Bus controllers "tree" containing either the word
'Enhanced'
or the abbreviation
'USB2'
.  Knowing the particulars of your
USB 2.0 host controller
is critical, so by following the procedure below such will become evident:

(1) go to Desktop and right click on My Computer;

(2) drop down to left click on Manage;

(3) in left pane, expand System Tools;

(4) in left pane, drop down to left click on Device Manager;

(5) for both USB controllers and mass storage Devices in right pane, expand Universal Serial Bus controllers;

(6) for USB Mass Storage Devices, skip down to (7) -
else
for USB 2.0 controllers, focus on those lines containing either the abbreviation
'USB2'
or the word
'Enhanced'
then go to (7);

(7) right click on any such lines that drop down, then left click on Properties;

(8) left click on the Details tab;

(9) left click on the dropdown menu containing Device Instance Id; and

(10) left click on
Hardware Ids
and carefully transcribe the last two lines in the window. To be overly generous, drop down two more lines and repeat for
Matching Device Id
.

While the image below is set to reveal the functional USB 2.0 controller on the Macally PHR-100A external HDD enclosure kit, take note that right above the red arrow is one of my Dell Dimension 8300's three
'Enhanced'
USB controllers - the Intel 80281EB is integrated into the motherboard while the other two are on PCI-to-USB host adapter cards:

...

If we are aware of what is both on the host end and on the device end of your USB 2.0 "bridge", then our knowledge base certainly increases.  For
"grins and giggles"
, how about using the stock Norton/Iomega drivers that automatically come with the PC-DOS option when generating a Standard Ghost Boot Disk in the Norton Ghost Boot Wizard; then, use the stock boot disk to perform an Image Integrity Check on an existing Backup image and document any stoppages that occur - IF ANY !!!  If there are NONE, that is even more important as either way we will know the degree of compatibility your USB 2.0 host/device controller bridge enjoys with Ghost 2003 and can counsel others in the future.  

El Pescador
 

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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #83 - Aug 21st, 2005 at 12:18pm
 
Thanks a lot for the help!!!!!. Grin Grin
PS: I am braziliam and I dont speek english. Embarrassed Embarrassed
 
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #84 - Aug 29th, 2005 at 5:26pm
 
People, look this.....

I'm try a boot for HD in NTFS. My files:





[config.sys]

[config.sys]

rem :The following line loads WD's universal USB-controller driver 
rem :The spaces between the filenames and the parameters are 
rem :'/e' forces USB 2.0 only, remove for USB 1.x also 
 
[menu] 
menuitem = FROMLIMPO1, Boot clean - USB1.1
menuitem = FROMLIMPO2, Boot clean - USB2.0 
menuitem = FROMGHOST1, GHOST - USB1.1
menuitem = FROMGHOST2, GHOST - USB2.0 
menuitem = FROMNTFS1, Boot clean with NTFS - USB1.1
menuitem = FROMNTFS2, Boot clean with NTFS - USB2.0 
menuitem = FROMGHOSTOKO, Boot GHOST with Guest - USB1.1 
menuitem = FROMGHOSTOK, Boot GHOST with Guest  - USB2.0 
menuitem = FROMCD, Boot CD Externo - USB1.1
menuitem = FROMCDT, Boot CD Externo - USB2.0

[FROMLIMPO1] 
DEVICE=oakcdrom.sys /d:mscd001 
DEVICE=usbaspi.sys /v
DEVICE=di1000dd.sys

[FROMLIMPO2] 
DEVICE=oakcdrom.sys /d:mscd001 
DEVICE=usbaspi.sys /e /v
DEVICE=di1000dd.sys

[FROMGHOST1] 
DEVICE=usbaspi.sys /v
DEVICE=di1000dd.sys
DEVICE=oakcdrom.sys /d:mscd001 

[FROMGHOST2] 
DEVICE=usbaspi.sys /e /v
DEVICE=di1000dd.sys 
DEVICE=oakcdrom.sys /d:mscd001 

[FROMNTFS1] 
DEVICE=usbaspi.sys /v
DEVICE=di1000dd.sys 
DEVICE=oakcdrom.sys /d:mscd001 

[FROMNTFS2] 
DEVICE=usbaspi.sys /e /v
DEVICE=di1000dd.sys 
DEVICE=oakcdrom.sys /d:mscd001 

[FROMGHOSTOKO] 
DEVICE=aspiohci.sys /int /all
DEVICE=aspiuhci.sys /int /all
DEVICE=oakcdrom.sys /d:mscd001 

[FROMGHOSTOK] 
DEVICE=ASPIEHCI.sys /int /all
DEVICE=oakcdrom.sys /d:mscd001 

[FROMCD] 
devicehigh=USBASPI.SYS /v /w
devicehigh=DI1000DD.SYS
devicehigh=USBCD.SYS /d:USBCD001

[FROMCDT] 
devicehigh=USBASPI.SYS /v /w /e
devicehigh=DI1000DD.SYS
devicehigh=USBCD.SYS /d:USBCD001

[COMMON] 
DEVICE=himem.sys
DOS=HIGH,UMB
LASTDRIVE=Z 



autoexec.bat

@echo off 
SET TZ=GHO-03:00 
path=z:\;z:\ghost;z:\pqmagic;z:\ntfs 
MOUSE.COM 
Mscdex.exe /d:mscd001 /l:z /m:16 /v
echo Loading... 

if %config% == FROMLIMPO1 goto LIMPOBOOT
if %config% == FROMLIMPO2 goto LIMPOBOOT
if %config% == FROMGHOST1 goto GHTBOOT
if %config% == FROMGHOST2 goto GHTBOOT
if %config% == FROMNTFS1 goto LIMPONT
if %config% == FROMNTFS2 goto LIMPONT
if %config% == FROMGHOSTOK goto GHTBOOTOK
if %config% == FROMGHOSTOKO goto GHTBOOTOK
if %config% == FROMCD goto BOOTCD
if %config% == FROMCDT goto BOOTCD

goto FAILED

:LIMPOBOOT
C:
goto END

:GHTBOOT
if exist z:\ghost\ghost.exe goto GHOSTOKLU

:LIMPONT
if exist z:\ntfs\ntfsdos.exe goto LIMPONTF

:GHTBOOTOK
if exist z:\ghost\ghost.exe goto GHOSTOK

:GHOSTOKLU
cd\ghost
GHOST.EXE
goto END


:LIMPONTF
cd\ntfs
NTFSDOS /L:ge /C:1024
goto END


:GHOSTOK
GUEST.EXE
cd\ghost
GHOST.EXE
goto END


:BOOTCD
MSCDEX /d:USBCD001
goto END


:FAILED
echo Unknown boot menu selection
goto END

:END



The option 3 (FROMGHOST2, GHOST - USB2.0 ) stops in the screen of the Ghost with HDs external in NTFS. Why???? Help me......
 
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #85 - Aug 30th, 2005 at 12:03pm
 
weblur 

The batch file coding looks okay--but, I'm not clear on what you are actually trying to do:

Quote:
I'm try a boot for HD in NTFS.


I don't understand what you are trying to say above.

Quote:
stops in the screen of the Ghost with HDs external in NTFS.


And, not sure what this means either.

If you could offer more detail, maybe I could understand the problem.
 

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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #86 - Aug 30th, 2005 at 4:35pm
 
NightOwl, sorry sorry...... I am braziliam and i don't speak english.


When I execute the GHOST using a HD with the system of archives in NTFS, the GHOST stop and congeals, or either, it does not function.
 
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #87 - Aug 30th, 2005 at 5:35pm
 
weblur

To load Ghost, it has to be on a partition that supports DOS--floppy disk FAT, FAT16, or FAT32, or the boot sector of a  bootable CD/DVD.  But Ghost will not be *seen* on a NTFS partition.

Once Ghost is loaded in DOS, Ghost can read data from a NTFS partition and save images to a NTFS partition.
 

No question is stupid...but, possibly the answers are Wink !&&
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #88 - Sep 1st, 2005 at 6:10am
 
hello guys, i really need some guidance here

i am new to this usb in DOS thingy

by objective is to ghost my internal 2gb HD to a USB 2.0 external 10gb HD which i bought recently
i use Norton Ghost 2002
now i understand that i need to perform the ghosting in Dos mode
as expected, i cannot detect my usb 10gb HD since i read in NightOwl's topic that USB drivers should be loaded in DOS
therefore, i followed NightOwl's instructions (beginning of this topic).

i run in step-by-step confirmation mode in Dos to see where the problem is, the following is what shows in my screen:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASPI Manager for USB Mass Storage Version 2.06
(C) Copyright Panasonic Communication Co., Ltd. 2000-2003

Controller : 00-01-2 VID=8086h PID=7112h(0000h-0000h) UHCI
                 I/O=FCEOh-FCFFh

USB Device: Host [00-01-2 VID=8086h PID=7112h(0000h-0000h) UHCI]
               :    |-- VID=04CFh PID=8818h FS
               :    ^ -- 1 Device (s)

ASPI Device: ID:0  LUN:0= IC25N010 ATDA04-0  DACO

DI1000 ASPI Disk Driver Ver. 2.00
Copyright (C) 2001 Novac Co., Ltd.

AVailable ID=0
ID 0 = HD . . IC25N010ATDA04-0
#1 :  ? ? ?  Read error in Partition read.
Read error in Boot Record read.
#2 :  ? ? ?
Your program caused a divide overflow error.
If the problem persists, contact your program vendor.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
then at this point, nothing happens, it like its stopped from there
i had to reboot

what could possibly be the problem ?
 
 
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Re: A Better USB 2.0 DOS Driver for Ghost + More!
Reply #89 - Sep 1st, 2005 at 10:43am
 
uwebow

1.  Have you followed the outline *exactly*, or are you modifying the config.sys and autoexe.bat files with additional command lines--i.e. are you trying to load other DOS support programs?

2.  For trouble shooting, disconnect all other USB devices except the HDD and see if that helps.

3.  Is your USB 1.0 or 1.1 for your controller and HDD?

4.  Is the USB HDD a USB only unit--or is it an *enclosure kit* unit that the HDD can be inserted and removed?

5.  What is the details of the hardware that you are using?
 

No question is stupid...but, possibly the answers are Wink !&&
 
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